FOX "Fox News Sunday with Chris Wallace" - Transcript: President's Islamic State Strategy

Interview

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WALLACE: General Keane, thank you. Always good to talk with you, sir.

What role if any does Congress have in America's new war against ISIS?

Joining us from Maine, independent Senator Angus King, who caucuses with the Democrats and sits on the Intelligence Committee.

And here in Washington, Wyoming Senator John Barrasso, chair of the Republican Policy Committee.

You both are on record saying that Congress should vote, should be in session right now debating whether or not to give the president the authorization to use force in the fight against ISIS.

So, Senator Barrasso, simple question -- why aren't you?

SEN. JOHN BARRASSO (R-WY), FOREIGN RELATIONS COMMITTEE: Well, I think the president has an obligation to call us back tomorrow to start this debate. We have been adjourned now until after the elections. This is the earliest Congress has adjourned in over 50 years. I don't think Harry Reid wants this debate or the vote. I think we have an obligation, the prime minister of Britain called the parliament back. No member of Congress should be left off of hook.

The Constitution is clear, Article I, Section 8, power vetted in Congress to declare war. If you go back to the founding documents of this nation, the decision of going to war was to be made by people closest to the ground, the elected officials, to make those decisions. I think that the public deserves it. They should be demanding it. The president is putting together an international coalition. It's time to put the coalition together at home as well.

WALLACE: Senator King, leaders of both parties, it's not just Harry Reid, there's no interest particularly with John Boehner and the House apparently want to duck this vote, so that members can go home, campaign and not have to defend a vote to their voters. Isn't this a profile in political cowardice?

SEN. ANGUS KING (I-ME), SELECT INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: Well, if you were looking for fireworks between me and John Barrasso today, you're not going to get it because I agree with his position. I think we ought to be there, we ought to be debating it.

The only caution I would take, Chris, is the last time we had a vote on whether or not to authorize force right before an election was in the midterms in 2002 when Congress voted for the invasion of Iraq. I don't think that was Congress's finest moment.

I'm not sure the timing is critical. I do think we ought to be doing it now, but the real issue is, does Congress assert their authority at all?

This goes back to Harry Truman in 1938. There was no declaration of war in Korea, thousands of people died. Presidents have gradually been gaining much more authority and Congress has been letting them get away with it.

And I think it's time for Congress to stand up, put itself on record and make some decisions here.

WALLACE: Senator Barrasso, you've been calling for the president to arm the Syrian rebels almost since the civil war started several years ago, and yet when the president asked for $500 million to arm and train the Syrian rebels to take on this fight against ISIS, you voted no.

BARRASSO: I voted -- well, it was a complete continuing resolution to fund the government for the next year at levels I didn't agree with. This is the problem when they jam a big piece of legislation onto the floor of the Senate and then put something in they want to get through.

WALLACE: So, did you support it?

BARRASSO: Absolutely. I've been calling for the support of the Syrian rebels for years. I met with a number of them in Germany a couple of years ago. I don't know how many of these are still alive. So, I absolutely want to do that.

We need to do it all. I believe that the president is right when he calls to degrade and destroy ISIS, the bombing will only go so far to degrade, but will not destroy. So, yes, arm the Kurds, help the Iraqi army, help with training the Syrians.

But, you have to face reality here. Over the next year, the best they can do with vetting, and training, equipping, is to get you to about 5,000 members of the Free Syrian Army against a bloodthirsty group of over 30,000, 2,000 with European passports, another 100 with American passports.

I think the president needs to work more closely with his generals. They got to get rid of this distrust that is between the two of them.

WALLACE: So, let's take a big picture here, Senator King, where are we now? We're bombing in Iraq with European allies. We're bombing in Syria with Arab allies. We're counting on local forces, whether it's the Iraqi army, the Peshmerga, the Free Syrian rebels to fight on the ground -- is that a winning strategy, Senator King?

BARRASSO: Well, it's not going to be a short strategy, but I think -- you used an important phrase, and it's sort of came without a comment, that's Arab allies. That's a big deal.

Having Saudi Arabia, (a), welcome the training of these Syrian rebels on their property with U.S. army troops there, having them fly missions this past weekend, having Jordan, United Arab Emirates actually flying missions, firing munitions. That's a big deal.

The big question mark right now, Chris, is Turkey. They're with us Monday, Wednesday and Friday. They're not with us Tuesday and Thursday. They take the weekends off.

I mean, I'm being a little facetious, but they're the highway. That's the jihadi highway, where a lot of these foreign fighters are getting there. Turkey's got to fish or cut bait. They've got to join us, I think, and they have reservations about the Kurds and those things, but this is a direct threat to them as well.

So, if we can get Turkey involved, we've got now something like 50 countries that are really stepping up, I think that's a big part of the project.

The other thing you mentioned or I think maybe Tony Blinken mentioned, the crucial part is the government in Baghdad, the Iraqi government. They've got to win over the Sunni majority up in northern Iraq. Otherwise, this whole thing is a fool's errand, and we're not going to be able to dislodge ISIS, as long as the Sunnis up there feel that ISIS is a better bet than Baghdad.

WALLACE: Finally, we got about two minutes left, and I want to share it equally and I want to switch subjects on you. Attorney General Holder announced this week that he is stepping down.

Let me ask you, first, Senator Barrasso. As a member of the Senate Republican leaders, what is Holder's legacy, and do you oppose a vote on his successor by a lame-duck session of the Senate? Does this need to wait until the new Senate comes in, in January?

BARRASSO: It does need to wait. I do oppose on any successor during the lame-duck session. If it happens, it would be the first time since the civil war when we've had a vote on an attorney general in a lame duck when parties switch. But this shows the desperation in how the Democrats feel threatened that they're going to lose control of the Senate.

And if this happens, this would be Harry Reid's ease final act in a tragic play that has been his legacy in Harry Reid's lead as leadership. Specifically with Holder -- I mean, to me he has been a political protector, a partisan protector of the president.

We need an attorney general for the people, not a presidential protector and a puppet of the administration. And if they try to do this in the lame duck session, this will clearly poison the well, and will define what we're going to see for the next two years, the final two years of the presidency of Barack Obama.

WALLACE: Senator King, your thoughts about Holder, about a vote in the lame-duck session, and do you have a potential successor in mind for him?

KING: I haven't heard any serious names at this point. I think Eric Holder is a good man. I think he's followed his conscience in many cases.

My disappointment was his failure to go after Wall Street after the crisis and, you know the not a single prosecution. That bothers me.

As far as the lame-duck session, the last time I looked, we're still at work and being paid until next January. We're still the Congress of the United States.

Let's see what the president does. He may not even put someone forward or he may put someone forward that everyone, Republicans included, say is a good solid candidate. I remember last spring, people saying they'll never get a DHS -- DHHS commissioner through, Sylvia Burwell was proposed, everybody thought she was terrific and she was confirmed.

So, I'm going to wait and see. I don't think there's any particular reason do it -- to not do it during the lame duck. We're still officially at work. Let's go to work.

WALLACE: We're on that hopeful bipartisan note, and I would emphasize the word "hopeful", Senator Barrasso, Senator King, thank you both. Thanks for coming in today.

BARRASSO: Thanks for having me.

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