MSNBC "Hardball with Chris Matthews" - Transcript: Ferguson, Missouri
Interview
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KORNACKI: All right, thank you, Sherrilyn Ifill from the NAACP. Appreciate that.
And with us now from Ferguson is U.S. Congressman Emanuel Cleaver. He`s a Democrat from Missouri. Congressman, appreciate the time.
You`re in the community, so let me just ask you this to start. I mean, the story today during the day about last night was, finally a break, finally, you know, peaceful protests and calm was sort of restored. In the wake of what`s happened today with this video, with the police being all over the map in terms of their explanation for that, what are you anticipating tonight?
REP. EMANUEL CLEAVER (D), MISSOURI: Well, I think the crowd is going to, obviously, be larger than it was last evening. And it`s a peaceful crowd. Black, white, brown individuals are gathering here peacefully.
But I can tell you this. What the police chief did today put on display monumental incompetency or a very elaborate conspiracy that people here believe to be what the police department will do.
There are witnesses with whom I have had contact today who will not even speak to the police department here -- they`re -- one of them, I think, met with the FBI a short time ago and one will meet with the FBI tomorrow -- because they are not in any way comfortable in having contact with the police here. They think that they are about cover-up. They believe that they are incompetent. And there is nothing that anybody can show me, tell me that would suggest anything otherwise.
Let us assume that Michael Brown stole some cigars. Nobody has even provided any information that that even happened, but let`s assume that. Then the issue is proportionality. Why would a police officer then become the police, the judge, the jury and the executioner for some cigars?
And I think that the police chief is trying to, I think, get us moving in one direction and then bring us back and try to create confusion and hope that in a while, that the media will leave and that the crowds will get smaller. That`s not going to happen. There will be a church service tonight on the other side of town, where people are going to start talking about reconciliation.
KORNACKI: Well, how...
CLEAVER: Let me just say it is extremely difficult to talk about reconciliation when the police chief is stirring the pot more than any demonstrator could ever do.
KORNACKI: You talk about witnesses who are afraid to talk to this -- to come forward to talk to this police department, all this sort of chaos today and the statements that have come from the police. Just looking at this investigation and going forward, are you confident this investigation is going to be able to get to the truth of this?
CLEAVER: If the police department of this town conducts the investigation, nobody is going to believe it. There is not a teacup full of trust by the community of the police department.
KORNACKI: Well...
(CROSSTALK)
CLEAVER: There is nobody who believes that it was...
KORNACKI: As I understand it, the county police right now are responsible for -- the county is investigating this, and then also the Justice Department`s come in to look for potential civil rights violations. With those two investigations in place, do you think we will get satisfactory answers on this?
CLEAVER: I do believe that the Justice Department and the FBI will conduct a thorough and fair investigation. And I hope that the police here, the police chief, will never come through and give any information that concludes one way or another on the investigation. He has no credibility...
KORNACKI: OK.
CLEAVER: ... in his own -- in his own town. One other thing.
KORNACKI: Quickly, yes.
CLEAVER: Police officers are not required to live here, and that`s a problem. They can live anywhere. So if this community is not good enough for them to live in, it`s not good enough for them to police in.
KORNACKI: Yes, that`s a theme we`ve been hearing a lot about, a police force that represents the community. Thank you, Congressman Emanuel Cleaver. Appreciate that.
CLEAVER: Sure.
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