Senator Schumer Discusses Anti-Spam Legislation on the "Capital Report"

MURRAY: Joining us now from the Capitol is Senator Charles Schumer, who introduced a bill to bust the spammers.

And, Senator, all I've got to say is--is thank goodness you're doing this. I mean, I don't know how much of the day I spending reading through mortgage offers and pornography and--why hasn't this happened before now?

Senator CHARLES SCHUMER (Democrat, New York): Well, I think two things have--or three have really accelerated this. First, you know, a year or two it used to get--it was just an annoyance. Now it's a serious problem. And if we wait another year or two, it'll render e-mail--it'll destroy e-mail. No one will go on, it'll be such a pain in the neck to sort out the few messages you want from all of the unsolicited. Second, I think there was a view that the ISPs could do it themselves--Microsoft, AOL--but actually every time they create a filter, the spammers are quicker and find a way around the filter.

BORGER: Se--Senator Schumer, AOL, in fact, estimates, I think, that 70 percent of all e-mail is now spam, and I just want to put up on the screen your bill and how your bill would try and handle this. First of all, there would be a no-spam list, similar to the FT--FTC's 'do not call' list.

Sen. SCHUMER: Right.

BORGER: And then there would be a real unsubscribe mechanism and enforced usage. And then there would also be penalties, including fines, prison time for non-compliance. Senator, what chance do you have of getting this through? Is this real bipartisan anti-spam legislation?

Sen. SCHUMER: Yeah, I think it i--you know, there--there--it is. We've been talking to Senator Hatch, who hasn't signed on yet, but he's favorable. Conrad Burns has a different bill, but the same goal; he's a Republican from Montana. And the bottom line is it's--it's perfectly legal to do this now. So what we do is use, Gloria, the very successful method of stopping telemarketing. You used to sit down to dinner and get 10 calls--you're up like a jackrabbit--of people soliciting. And the FTC and many states as well said, 'OK. We're going to set out a list, we passed a law, and if you put your phone number on the list, it's illegal to call it.' And now the number of calls--it's not eliminated, but went way, way down. But same thing with spam.

MURRAY: But--but, Senator, the difference between spam and telemarketing is, to be a telemarketer, you have to have a fairly big operation, you gotta have a bunch of phones, a bunch of people working those phones. And so you can find those people and enforce it. The problem with these spam folks is they work out of a garage or a room, they work off of--you know, they can change computers. I mean, can you really enforce these kinds of requirements against the people doing spam?

Sen. SCHUMER: The people who send millions of spams out every day and do it on a big, big basis--we'll find them. And the idea that they can be fined significantly so it's not profitable for them, and then eventually they could g--actually get jail time--that'll be a pretty big deterrent. The fly-by-night guy who occasionally does it and then goes to another computer will be harder to stop. This is not a cure-all, but instead of getting 70 a day, you'd get three or four.

BORGER: What--what if they say they have a right to free speech like everybody else in this country?

Sen. SCHUMER: Well, that's been the biggest barrier, and that's why no bill is passed. But our marketing registry deals with that because anyone who wants to get spam can keep getting it.

BORGER: Oh, good.

Sen. SCHUMER: If you don't want it, you just put it on--you put your--your e-mail address on this list, and it is a crime to send you--to send you spam.

MURRAY: I'll tell you part of the reason I'm so outraged by this, Senator, is--aside from the time it takes me every day, is I have children, as you do, who spend a lot of time on e-mail and get the most outrageous unsolicited e-mail that you could imagine.

Sen. SCHUMER: Right. And every time they find a filter, these spammers find a way around it. They've learned to put messages up, 'Please call Joe.' Well, everyone knows someone named Joe, and so you open it up and then you find it's pornographic. I have two teen-age daughters, and the stuff they get on their spam and their e-mail is enormous. And the kids use e-mail more than we do. My kids are at the computer much more than they're watching television.

BORGER: Senator, before you leave, I have to ask you a question about something we're going to discuss later on in the show, and that is Hillary Clinton's new book. I'm wondering whether you've actually gotten a sneak peek at it, Senator.

Sen. SCHUMER: Not yet. I have not. The publishers get it first, I think.

BORGER: Oh, OK. Well, when you do, you have to let us know what's in it.

Sen. SCHUMER: I will.

BORGER: OK.

Sen. SCHUMER: All right.

BORGER: Thanks a lot, Senator Schumer.