NBC "The Rachel Maddow Show" - Transcript: Continuing Resolution and Debt Limit

Interview

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REP. CHRIS VAN HOLLEN (D), MARYLAND: It`s good to be with you,
Rachel.

MADDOW: What is going to happen tonight in the House? Do you expect that this bill will definitely pass and this will definitely be done tonight?

VAN HOLLEN: Well, you know and as you just said, it is always premature to be predicting things in this house. But I do believe that now that Speaker Boehner is finally allowing the House to work its will, we will be able to pass this. As we speak, I think the papers are being brought over to the House from the Senate. We`re going to try and get unanimous consent to bring this up for a vote and get it done. But again, it is important to emphasize the only reason we`re able to do this now after these 15 long days, is because the speaker has finally after exhausting all the bad alternatives which have really hurt the country, finally allowing democracy to work its will, something he could have done 15 days ago and avoided this whole mess and all the pain that is generated.

MADDOW: There were 18 Republicans in the Senate who voted no on the bill that did pass there, that is now headed your way. I expect that if not all, at least most Democrats are going to vote yes to reopen the government and to avert the debt ceiling crisis. If that happens, how much of a defection can Speaker Boehner afford? How much leeway does he really have?
How much of a cushion is there?

VAN HOLLEN: Well, I think you`re right, Rachel. You will going to see virtually every Democrat -- not every Democrat vote in favor of reopening the government and preventing us from defaulting on our debts. That would mean that Speaker Boehner would have to have 17 Republicans join him. So I`m sure that there is a margin to do that. How many Republicans will vote for this, in the end, I don`t know. What you`re seeing here as you indicated by that litany that you went through is really the final death throes of what Senator Richard Byrd, the Republican from North Carolina said that weeks and weeks ago, was the dumbest idea he ever heard.

If this had just been a dumb idea, that would be bad enough, but this has been a tragedy and disgrace that the country did not need in an unnecessary one. These kind of self-inflicted wounds are things that we hope our Republican colleagues will avoid in the future. You asked whether anything will change. The question is whether people have learned that lesson?

MADDOW: We`re already starting to see on the rights trying to spin this as maybe it was not so bad. Or maybe the reason that things seemed to have gone south here or people are blaming us for this is just because of the squishes, because Republicans are too moderate and they compromise too much. We`re seeing the right gearing up for this as a permanent way of doing business. I guess my question to you is not, you know, why they`re doing that or how effective they`re going to be at doing that. But whether or not they still hold sway in the House. Do you feel like the house is still going to be sort of dancing to the tune played by these outside groups that don`t really care about the long-term health of the country?

VAN HOLLEN: Well, time will tell. I mean, that is exactly the question we`re all asking ourselves. We heard Senator Cruz on the Senate floor today say by God, if the Senate Republicans had just stuck together and kept all this for another week we would have undone the Affordable Care Act, we would have gotten rid of ObamaCare. If the House leadership and the members of the House remain that deluded this time around, then the country is in for a very, very bumpy ride. If Speaker Boehner and other members of his leadership are finally willing to stand up to the Ted Cruz faction in the House of Representatives, then we have some hope of getting on a better course. But only the future will tell.

Look, the only good news that you might find in what happened is the possibility that the Republican leadership recognized that you don`t get your way by threatening government shutdowns and threatening default. But whether or not they have in fact learned that lesson, we will only know going forward. As you said, we`re finally pleased to have negotiations on the budget. We have been trying to do this since last march. So maybe we`ll sit down and maybe Republicans will put down the clubs of government shutdown and threats of default, and actually have a negotiation on the budget. But time will tell.

MADDOW: Congressman Chris Van Hollen of Maryland, the ranking Democrat on the House Budget Committee. I know you`re about to be very busy, I know the House just started its work on this bill tonight. Thanks for taking the time to explain to us what is going on. I appreciate your time.

VAN HOLLEN: Thanks, Rachel.

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