MSNBC "The Rachel Maddow Show" - Transcript: Government Shutdown

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Joining us now is Senator Charles Schumer of New York, vice chair of the Democratic Conference.

Senator Schumer, thank you for being with us.

SEN. CHARLES SCHUMER (D), NEW YORK: Good evening.

MADDOW: What do you know about the latest matters of procedure this evening? We know that the House has been meeting privately to decide how to respond to the Senate`s latest action.

SCHUMER: Yes, look, I think that, as you say -- there`s just a faction in the House that wants to shut the government down, that doesn`t mind taking hostages, whether it`d be a federal worker who needs a paycheck, a highway construction worker who gets a federal grant, a veteran waiting to adjust a disability claim. They don`t really care.

But let me say this, the public does. The closer we get to this moment, the more and more people see what the Republicans are doing and the less popular they are. And that`s why today we`ve had many Republicans, including some conservative ones, say we shouldn`t shut the government down.

The real weak kink in this, the real weak link is Speaker Boehner. Even Mitch McConnell, with the Tea Party opponent, figured out a way that he would let things move forward, not shut the government down. He voted with 24 of his colleagues not to block us, but Boehner doesn`t seem to have that strength.

And a small group of real fanatics who sort of feel that they have to sacrifice innocent people to the right-wing gods so they can show how tough and resolute they are controls Boehner, and, unfortunately, controls many in the House Republican Caucus who really know better.They know it`s a disaster for their party. They know it`s a disaster for the country. They know they`re hurting innocent people. But they don`t care.

There is such anger, there is such hatred that they just act on those emotions. And sooner or later, that catches up to you. I don`t think -- I would hope that they come to their senses tonight. You know, they always thought we`d cave, but we are united from one end of this Democratic Caucus to the other. The White House is strong. Tonight, the president said we`re not doing this debt ceiling either and we haven`t caved.

And now, the leadership of the Republican House is stuck -- stuck between these fanatical right-wingers and what they know is wrong not only for the country, but actually, for the future of their party.

MADDOW: Senator, you`ve seen a lot of different confrontations in Washington come and go, you`ve seen a lot of iterations of the Republican Party as they have changed over the years, particularly in the last few years.

What do you think specifically about Republican senators? So, Republicans in your chamber advising the House on what they ought to be doing, advising House members to defy their leadership, to defy Speaker Boehner and do instead what the Senate wants?

SCHUMER: We`ve never seen anything like it. But the bottom line is that Senator Cruz and his small band did not get a majority of support in the Republican Senate, and there were some courageous profiles and coverage of people like Lindsey Graham, Lamar Alexander, who had Tea Party opponents but who knew they shouldn`t go along.

These are more mainstream conservatives. But this small band, given the fact that they have talk radio, they have a whole blogging radio, Jim DeMint does far more damage outside than in with the Heritage Action Foundation.

They frighten these Republicans and say you don`t go along with us.

Even though you know it`s wrong, you know it`s irrational, you know it`s bad, we`re going to give you primary. And too many Republicans in the House shrug their shoulders and say, OK. I think the jubilation you saw there is not universal in the
Republican caucus. There are large numbers in the Republican House caucus
who know this is wrong. Very few have the courage of Pete King to stand up and say so.But privately, they admit it. And I think that, you know, God forbid we`ll shut down the government, there is going to be such a reaction against them that they`re going to have to back off, hopefully after a few days.

MADDOW: Senator Chuck Schumer of New York. Thank you for your time tonight. I know you`re in a middle of vote, sir. So, I`ll let you go. Thank you very much.

SCHUMER: Thank you. Good to talk to you.

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