CNN "The Situation Room" - Transcript: ACA and Government Shutdown

Interview

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BLITZER: In a huge battle over Obamacare and a possible government shutdown, Senator Ted Cruz got some important help from a fellow Republican, a Tea Party favorite. We're talking about Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky.

The senator is joining us now.

Senator, thanks, as usual, for coming in.

SEN. RAND PAUL (R), KENTUCKY: Good to be with you, Wolf.

BLITZER: So, when all the dust settles at midnight Monday night, will the government remain funded and will Obamacare remain funded?

PAUL: You know, I'm not sure what the answer is to that.

I think the government funding will go on. It seems to be a message sausage factory up here, but things seem to get turned down and government continues to go on. And some of that is good, because I think people depend on government and it would be disruptive to them all of a sudden to be without checks. But some of it's bad in the sense that we're spending a trillion dollars we don't have, we're borrowing from our kids' future.

So there's some good that we don't disrupt things, but some bad. The continuation of piling up so much debt is not good for our kids or our grandkids.

BLITZER: You're obviously a really smart guy. Do you believe that there's any way, any way between now and Monday night at midnight you can defund Obamacare?

PAUL: I think we fight on and we find out where the votes shake out on this.

I think Obamacare is a bad plan for America. I think it is going to raise insurance costs, cause a lot of part-time workers to lose hours, maybe even full-time workers to lose jobs. I think we should do everything we can do to defeat it. But we're against long odds. We're against the majority in the Senate that's Democrats who wants Obamacare. We're against the president. It's his signature issue.

So, what I have been saying all along is the president wants 100 person of Obamacare. We don't want any part of it. Maybe the in- between solution is we try to get rid of some of the worst parts of it. And that would be having some amendments, some discussion. But so far there's been no discussion from the Democrats and no indication that they will compromise at all.

BLITZER: But that is not going to be possible realistically between now and Monday night. That is going to have to wait another day. And that raises the next question. Assuming you continue to fund the government, assuming Obamacare goes into effect fully funded on October 1 next Tuesday, are you going to play the same card as far as raising the debt ceiling, which expires October 17, according to the Treasury Department? You're going to have to raise the debt ceiling. Otherwise, the U.S. will default.

PAUL: Well, that's true and not true.

Part of what you're saying is eventually we might default, but we bring in about $250 billion a month in revenue from taxes. Interest payment is only about $30 billion. So we would never have to default by not having enough tax revenue. Although we do spend about 30 percent more than we bring in, which leads to a large trillion dollar deficit, technically, we could balance our budget and continue on without raising the debt ceiling.

And some people think, well, gosh, maybe we should start only spending what comes in. The bottom line in all of this battle is, I think neither side gets everything they want, but really the discussion needs to be that the Democrats and the president appear to be refusing to negotiate even on things members of their own parties are saying are wrong with Obamacare.

BLITZER: I want you to listen to Senator Cruz and Senator McCain. We have got some sound bites from what they said over past 24 hours. And then I will want you to weigh in. Listen to this.

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SEN. TED CRUZ (R), TEXAS: If you go to the 1940s, Nazi Germany, look, we saw in Britain Neville Chamberlain, who told the British people, accept the Nazis. Yes, they will dominate the continent of Europe, but that's not our problem. Let's appease them. Why? Because it can't be done. We can't possibly stand against them. And, in America, there were voices that listened to that.

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: I think it's wrong, and I think it's a disservice to those who stood up and shouted at the top of their lungs that we cannot appease, and that we must act, and we did act. And it's a disservice to those who did act.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: How awkward was that comparison to the Nazis in this current debate over Obamacare, Senator?

PAUL: I ahead Obamacare about as much as anybody, but I'm not a real big fan of either Hitler or Chamberlain comparisons, because obviously war is a different subject.

And I am sensitive to people who are always trotting this up, and calling everybody this or that name from history. Obamacare is a bad thing, and we ought to discuss it on its own merits. But that's where I am. I think we ought to just stick to Obamacare.

BLITZER: I think you're probably right on that. You can discuss and debate Obamacare, but bringing in Nazis and Hitler and all of this obviously not appropriate.

One final question. Is a lot of this about 2016, this whole debate right now?

PAUL: Maybe, maybe not.

And going back a little bit to the Nazis, I have spoke for 13 hours, not 20 hours. So, I would also say that Senator Cruz deserves a little leeway when he's in his 20th hour of what he's saying.

BLITZER: That's a fair point as well.

All right, Senator, thanks very much. The debate continues. Let's see what happens midnight -- by midnight Monday night, Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky.

PAUL: Thank you.

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