Fox News "On the Record with Greta Van Susteren" - Transcript - IRS Targeting Controversy

Interview

BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT

VAN SUSTEREN: So were Oversight Committee members satisfied with the answers they got today from the IRS? Congressman Jim Jordan joins us. Nice to see you, sir.

REP. JIM JORDAN, R-OHIO: Good to be with you, Greta.

VAN SUSTEREN: In that sound bite with Griff Jenkins, Beth Tucker, who is essentially number three as deputy commissioner, said that -- that they all do their best. And I assume she means she was doing her best, too. However, in May of 2012, she knew all about the targeting (INAUDIBLE) investigation, and she just sat there and did zero!

JORDAN: Yes, she was in the meeting when the inspector general informed her, Steve Miller and Doug Shulman, the same guy who went to the White House 157 times, when they were informed this targeting was taking place. And she didn't come forward to correct the record.

Mr. Shulman's gone from the IRS. Mr. Miller's been fired. She's the top- ranking official who was there when this was happening, when they were notified about it. She's still there.

She didn't feel it was incumbent upon her to come forward and set the record straight, even though her boss at the time had already testified two months prior to Congress and said he could give us assurances that no targeting was going on.

Every time you pull on a string with this deal, it just unravels more and more, from sweetheart deals to now the second person taking the 5th to conferences where extravagant spending of taxpayer dollars takes place, and on and on it goes.

And we're just going to keep pursuing this. And you know how it is as a prosecutor. Takes time to get to the truth. You got to interview lots of people. And we're slowly, steadily getting there, but we're just getting started, frankly.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right, is it time for a special prosecutor?

JORDAN: It may be.

VAN SUSTEREN: Because -- the attorney general apparently is just sitting there (INAUDIBLE) DOJ. This has been going on for years. I mean, it's been going on for years, these problems at the IRS. And with all due respect to Congress, is the -- a lot of this stuff has been going on for years and didn't get under -- get uncovered. Is it time for a special prosecutor with subpoena power and with the power to present to a grand jury?

JORDAN: Well, Greta, maybe down the road. Right now -- remember, we have subpoena power. We've interviewed --

VAN SUSTEREN: You can't go to a grand jury and get indictments!

JORDAN: I understand. But we've interviewed 11 people. Each time we interview someone, we find out another person ...

VAN SUSTEREN: So what --

(CROSSTALK)

VAN SUSTEREN: What more notice do you need that there's a real serious problem over there? You can't -- you can't take it to a grand jury for indictment! Turn it over to a special prosecutor! Get someone who will do something about this!

JORDAN: And in fact, we may need to that, particularly in light of -- down the road, we may need to do that, particularly in light of the FBI's response. Just a week and a half ago, I asked the FBI, the director of the FBI, who was heading up the investigation? How many agents -- you would think something of this magnitude --

VAN SUSTEREN: And the answer was?

JORDAN: He didn't know! He didn't know how many people were on the case! He didn't who the -- you would think something of this magnitude, a story of this concern to the American people, you would put your best lawyer, your best investigative team on it, and he couldn't even tell me --

VAN SUSTEREN: How about just anybody!

JORDAN: Yes, well --

VAN SUSTEREN: I mean, how about just anybody!

JORDAN: I'm sure there's -- there are people on it and there are people working -- but he couldn't tell me, which again underscores the lack of focus and priority that this must have at the FBI.

What scared me more about this than anything else, though, Greta, is that the same FBI who couldn't tell me who was heading up the investigation visited Tea Party people last year and the year before when they were applying for the tax-exempt status!

That's an IRS question. What's the FBI doing showing up at people's door who were applying for tax-exempt status? When in America did you get a friendly visit from your local FBI agent when you were simply saying, I want to exercise my 1st Amendment rights to political speech and apply for tax-exempt status? That is as chilling and scary as it gets!

VAN SUSTEREN: OK, that even proves my point more! It's time for a special prosecutor because the attorney general, who is the boss of the FBI, apparently -- I mean, he -- you look at it -- look what's happening. Nothing! Is it time for someone who actually has seriousness of purpose and ability to go to grand jury?

JORDAN: Here's where we are on the committee. It may come to that. But right now, our committee is plowing through this. We're learning more and more each day. We got good staff there. Members on the committee are focused on this. You saw from some of the questions that you played.

We're committed to getting to the truth. There may come a point where this is -- where we do need a special prosecutor to ultimately (ph) get to the truth. The goal of the truth. It takes time to get there. We're plowing through it.

VAN SUSTEREN: Congressman, thank you. And I wish you the best of luck because this -- I mean, the stories just are absolutely -- they just keep going on and on and on!

JORDAN: Exactly. Thank you.

VAN SUSTEREN: Thank you, sir.

JORDAN: Thank you.

Source