CNN Crossfire - Transcript

CNN

SHOW: CNN CROSSFIRE 16:30

September 3, 2004 Friday

HEADLINE: 60 Days Left For Bush and Kerry

GUESTS: Vito Fossella, Gregory Meeks, Richard Stein

BYLINE: Jacqui Jeras, Wolf Blitzer, Karl Penhaul, Alina Cho, James Carville, Tucker Carlson

BODY:

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CARLSON: Well, both President Bush and Senator John Kerry are sending their best wishes to former President Bill Clinton, who is ailing here in New York. It may be the only thing the president and the senator can agree at this point as they race from one campaign rally to the next.

A just-released "TIME" magazine poll shows that, for the very first time since the presidential race became a two-man contest last spring, there is a clear leader. And it is-surprise-President Bush, who has opened a 52-41 percent lead, according to "TIME"'s poll.

We're joined by two members of New York's congressional delegate, Democrat Gregory Meeks and Republican Vito Fossella.

Thanks for joining us both.

REP. VITO FOSSELLA ®, NEW YORK: Good to be with you.

CARLSON: Mr. Meeks, everyone-there is just bipartisan consensus of hope that President Clinton gets better. And there's no doubt in my mind that he will. He's young and vigorous.

Do you think there's any political implication to this? He is, let's be honest, much more popular than John Kerry among Democrats. And I imagine the Kerry campaign was counting on his help this fall for the next two months as he barnstorms the country. If it turns out he can't accompany John Kerry, that hurts Kerry doesn't it?

REP. GREGORY MEEKS (D), NEW YORK: Well, no. Bill Clinton is the comeback kid, No. 1. So I know he's going to be back. And we do wish him well that he is going to have a speedy recovery.

But I think really what this race is about which direction is America going to move in? Are we going to go in the wrong direction, as George Bush has led us, or in the right direction? And I think, as we get to deal with the issues that are important, the American people are going to want to go in the right direction, because they understand that George Bush is leading us in the wrong direction, wrong with jobs, wrong with health care, wrong with Iraq.

(CROSSTALK)

CARLSON: Congressman, I'm not sure they do understand that. According to a new "TIME" magazine poll and despite the propaganda that just emerged from your lips, it turns out that 52 percent of Americans when asked said they prefer President Bush. But the significant number is this. Only 41 percent said they preferred John Kerry. That's a huge spread, 11 points, and it's something we haven't seen for the past, say, six months. And it's kind of an ominous sign. You're terrified, aren't you?

MEEKS: No, look, we just finished the Republican Convention. You all had four days of masquerade party, where you masqueraded, you masquerade what your issues are, you told different things to the American people. That's going to come to an end now.

John Kerry gave the opening note at 12:00 a.m. last night. That is going to change. You got this bump. The bump will be over. The American people will hear the truth, as John Kerry moves forward.

CARLSON: And it will set them free, I imagine.

CARVILLE: Congressman Fossella, I'm just kind of curious. We've got to get to some reality here. Today, the job numbers were nothing short of pathetic, 144,000 jobs, which, if you had that every month, you would lose almost as many jobs as Bush has lost everywhere.

When do you think that this president will be able to get this country where it is actually creating more jobs and jobs are coming on? Is it possible that he could possibly do this?

FOSSELLA: I think, given the fact that the president inherited a recession and got through the largest tax cut to help rebuild our economy and put people back to work, he deserves a lot of credit.

(CROSSTALK)

FOSSELLA: And, secondly, I think the most important issue facing this country is our national security. And that's why I think you see the poll numbers move the way they do. They see two people. One is a strong, principled leader in President Bush, the one who is going to cut taxes on the American people and make this country the ownership society that belongs to people.

CARVILLE: So you don't really have an answer on jobs, so let's go to national security. And let me say, the president in June said we could win the war on terror. And then, in late August, he said we couldn't win the war on terror.

So while we were losing all these jobs, what happened to convince the president between June, when he said we could win the war on terror, and late August, when he said we couldn't? What was the intervening event there? It couldn't have been the jobs we're losing, because you want to go right to your turf, foreign policy.

FOSSELLA: The turf, again, is I think more people are working. And we need to give-I think the president believes that we need to give employers the opportunity to hire more people and create more jobs. And he's doing that.

The answers are here in New York City and across this country. And the answer doesn't necessarily come out of Washington. In terms of foreign policy and on national security, the truth is clear. We are winning the war on terror. The president believes that to be true. And, fortunately, we have brave men and women who wear our nation's uniform in the Air Force, the Marines and the Army, who are across the board in Afghanistan and Iraq.

They're going to be the reasons why not only are we going to be safe, but millions will be free. And that's the message that the American people are hearing between now and November. And I believe that is why President Bush will be reelected.

CARLSON: Congressman, the poll that we just were talking about gets more interesting when you break it up.

What I was surprised by is that, of all the issues presented by pollsters to respondents, the economy was the No. 1 concern of most people asked. And George Bush won when you asked people who's a better steward of that economy. If Democrats can't win on that question, they have no chance in the fall. You know that.

MEEKS: Democrats are going to win on all the issues, because Democrats are moving in the right direction.

You just came from a month where you had this masquerade party. And what's going to come out clearly-you don't have to take my word for it. But people are manufacturing John Kerry's record. In fact, you can just look at today's "Wall Street"-I mean today's "Washington Post" talking about how his record is being distorted by the GOP. And these facts are going to soon come out.

I urge all of them out there to begin-just pick it up on the Web site and look at the record of-especially about defense and watch how similar that Dick Cheney, talking about the 1990s, different period of time, talking about downgrading some of our weapons systems, because we're going after the Soviet Union.

Look at it. The truth is going to come out. Now the time for this-the four days that they had, those days are over. The truth will come out.

(CROSSTALK)

CARLSON: Hold on.

(CROSSTALK)

CARLSON: Hold on.

CARVILLE: Go ahead.

CARLSON: Given that most records haven't yet seen "The Washington Post," do you find-it's sort of telling that even after week after week of Kerry calling Bush a coward because he didn't fight so bravely in Vietnam, et cetera, et cetera, that Kerry is still losing on national security and terrorism by 21 points. Why is that?

MEEKS: Wait a minute. You have got it wrong.

(CROSSTALK)

MEEKS: You have got a convention where they mentioned Kerry's name more than they mentioned Bush's name. Never once did I hear Osama bin Laden's name.

And we're fighting the war on terror, I think that's the person who has terrorized us, not-not Iraq. We talk about an administration that said in the beginning that it would cost us $20 billion and that the American taxpayers wouldn't have to pay for it, that it would come from the oil reserves in Iraq.

Well, we're now above $200 billion, spending $1.5 billion a week, based upon the lies that we were told. We were told when we went into Iraq they were going to be waving the American flag. Well, we don't see that happening yet. So there seems to be-it's a disaster. And when the president said

(CROSSTALK)

CARVILLE: Congressman, I'm sorry to interrupt you, but we have got to go to-OK.

When we come back, our guests face "Rapid Fire." And we'll ask what in the world got into John Kerry last night.

And just ahead, we'll get the latest on President Bill Clinton and Hurricane Frances. Wolf Blitzer reports right after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Wolf Blitzer in New York.

Coming up at the top of the hour, former President Bill Clinton faces heart surgery in New York City. We'll have details.

Hurricane Frances slams the Bahamas and bears down on Florida. We'll got there for the latest.

And a bloody end to the Russian school standoff. Hundreds are dead or wounded.

Those stories, much more, only minutes away on "WOLF BLITZER REPORTS." Now back to CROSSFIRE.

CARVILLE: It's time for "Rapid Fire," where we ask questions a whole lot faster than the Bush economy is creating jobs.

We're talking to two of New York's finest congressmen, Democrat Gregory Meeks and Republican Vito Fossella.

Congressman Fossella, we have already wasted $200 billion in Iraq. The budget deficit is going to come in now and projected it may be around $500 billion. What is President Bush going to say in October?

FOSSELLA: I think he's saying what he said all along. The core of our fundamental values is freedom and opportunity to the American people. And I think we also have a responsibility to liberate others, while securing our national interests.

And that's why the president has been willing to wage this war against terror. And when given the choice between raising taxes or reducing taxes, he's choosing reducing taxes by placing his faith in the American people. And I think you'll hear that time and time again.

CARLSON: Now, Congressman Meeks, you said nice words a moment ago about Senator Kerry's midnight speech last night, leading me to believe you must not have seen it, because it was completely disjointed. He ad-libbed it. A lot of his lines didn't make sense.

Shouldn't they give him a script to read before he goes on national television?

MEEKS: No, I think it was very clear.

And what was very clear is that he's not going to sit back and allow individuals to discredit him, when he knows that he's a hero.

CARLSON: He does think he's a hero.

(CROSSTALK)

MEEKS: And, Tucker, he is not going to allow Dick Cheney-because I wonder where he was when it was time for him to be called-he's not going to George Bush, he's not going to allow the swift boat guys or any of that to discredit him, when he knows what he did.

And he wants George Bush to come out. I want to know when Bush is going to agree to those three debates so they can stand up mano-a- mano next to one another?

CARVILLE: There are indications that-there have traditionally been three presidential debates. There are indications that President Bush, who of course his whole life has been shirking from responsibility and confrontation, that he only wants two.

Do you think, as a Republican, isn't this is a sort of ninny-fied thing to have two debates, when the country has always seen three?

(BELL RINGING)

FOSSELLA: Oh, I don't know. I think the jury is still out on that. And I think, in terms of shirking responsibility, I think the president has been elected once. He will be reelected because he...

(CROSSTALK)

CARLSON: ... going to refight that. We are out of time.

(CROSSTALK)

CARLSON: Thank you both very much. We'll do that show again.

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