MSNBC "Rachel Maddow Show" - Transcript

Interview

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REP. PETER WELCH (D), VERMONT: Good to be here.

MADDOW: This vote in the House tonight seems to me designed to prove one thing, that Republicans are willing to let the country hit the debt ceiling if they don"t get their demands met. That is how it seems too me in New York looking at the politics here.

From your vantage point in Congress in Washington, do you think that was the point of this vote tonight?

WELCH: Well, it was. I mean, you know, this is taking Washington double speak to Washington triple speak. You had the advocates of the proposal saying, as they introduced it, that they were going to vote to kill it.

And then they went back to their offices and quietly called Wall Street to re-assure them that they didn"t mean it. They"re just kidding. And, in fact, what they voted against, they ultimately will support--some time under some conditions they"ll vote to increase the debt ceiling. So, it"s no wonder.

Now, the other thing is that the Republicans said something that sounds on its face reasonable. They want to pair long-term deficit reduction with this vote. But the fact is they had a chance to bring a bill to the floor to do it.

But they brought a stick pony to use your analogy because if they had a plan that they could pass, they had an opportunity today to present it. Their failure to bring it up indicates, (a), they didn"t have the votes to pass it, or what they would present, essentially the Ryan budget that does kill Medicare, because that"s where their big, quote, "savings" comes from, the American people wouldn"t support.

So, this was a dodge and duck, three-card Monte kind of a scam presented to the American Congress. And I think the American people get it.

MADDOW: Those assurances from congressional Republicans to Wall Street after the vote that you"re describing, assurances to Wall Street that they didn"t really mean it--do you think they don"t really mean it? You think if it comes to August 2nd, which is really the drop dead date here, and the vote hasn"t happened, that they really would vote no?

WELCH: You know what? I take them deadly seriously when they say that they will take money out of Medicare. They"ve done it. You know, the Ryan budget, to give them credit, was explicit.

And he said what he have to do in order to save money is do two things: one we have to cut taxes for wealthy people--he claims and believes that will create jobs despite the fact evidence shows that"s not the case. And then, secondly, in order to pay for those tax cuts, he had to increase the cost of health care for seniors by taking away Medicare. Anybody 55 and under would not have Medicare today. They wouldn"t have it.

So, that"s--now, they"re trying to back away from the reality of that even though they fully embrace:(a), the tax cut philosophy for the wealthy and, (b), having Medicare pay paid for so losers lose Medicare.

MADDOW: Let me ask you about Democratic strategy here. I know that you are--I would consider you both a progressive and a pragmatist. You can certainly take issue with me on either of those if you like.

WELCH: I deny it.

(LAUGHTER)

MADDOW: I understand.

As far as I can see, Democrats have been willing to pass and discuss reforms to Medicare in the past.

WELCH: Absolutely.

MADDOW: But now that Republicans are voting by 98 percent to just get rid of Medicare, to privatize it out of existence--does that call for a sharper defense of the program as it exists now from Democrats? If nothing else to make clear the Democrats will keep Medicare safe in an environment in which it is really threatened.

WELCH: Well, see, I think we are making a very spirited defense of Medicare. It is extremely popular and it works. And I think the Democrats are drawing lines in the sand about defending Medicare.

Now, a lot of us who are--for instance, I"m from Vermont, we"re pushing the single-payer there. We understand that the health care system has to have reform to bring cost under control.

In the issue here that is important is how do you get health care costs under control? Well, it"s delivery system reforms, it"s payment system reforms, it"s accountable care organizations. It"s getting away from fee for service.

If we do those things, what you"re going to do is make health care sustainable and affordable.

But the approach that the Ryan budget takes is basically to slash and eliminate Medicare altogether. It doesn"t reform it. It eliminates it.

MADDOW: Congressman Welch, I want to thank you for being with us tonight. I want to ask you if you wouldn"t mind here on national TV making a date with me for another time. I know you"ve been doing a lot of interesting sort of relationship-building and bridge-building in the House on the issue of Afghanistan and the drawdown in Afghanistan. I"m hoping you"ll join us in the next few days to talk about those politics.

WELCH: Bring the real pony. Not the stick pony.

MADDOW: Exactly. Thank you, sir. Appreciate it.

WELCH: Thank you.

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