MSNBC "The Ed Show" - Transcript

Interview

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We"ll start with you, Congresswoman Schakowsky, your thoughts at this hour. What does John Boehner have to do? They"re not saying anything. They"re going back to their caucus. Where do you think it stands?

REP. JAN SCHAKOWSKY (D), ILLINOIS: Well, I think Chuck Todd was wise to point out that this isn"t just about money, even though they are acting as if it"s about the budget and it"s about the cuts, that this is the social policies, the social agenda of the Republicans. They want to defund Planned Parenthood, which, by the way, is supported by -- 53 percent to 43 percent of Americans think it is a good idea to fund them.

And they want to defund the Environmental Protection Agency when it comes to having any jurisdiction over greenhouse gases. Imagine, the Environmental Protection Agency can"t protect us.

And those are the kinds of ways that they want to legislate their agenda, pretending that it"s really just about the budget. You know, they cannot take yes for an answer. It"s hard and terrible as the cuts that have been agreed to are, that it"s really not about those cuts.

SCHULTZ: And, Congresswoman, let me ask you, if it were put to a vote right now, would every Democrat vote for it as it stands just to be with the president to help them out?

SCHAKOWSKY: Oh, I think we have to see what they"re doing, particularly on those social provisions that they add. I certainly could not vote for something that cuts Planned Parenthood.

SCHULTZ: OK.

And let"s go to Bernie Sanders.

Senator, as you see it right now, how much more can the Democrats give?

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I), VERMONT: Ed, the Democrats have already given far, far too much at a time when so many people in the middle class are hurting, when poverty is increasing--what the Republicans have succeed in doing is moving toward deficit reduction, solely on the backs of the weak and the vulnerable. The richest people in this country and largest corporations that are doing phenomenally well have not been asked to contribute one nickel toward deficit reduction.

And now, as Jan Schakowsky just said, on top of all of that, these guys, these right wing extremists, are prepared to shut down the government because they want the city of Washington, D.C. not to be able to use their own money for abortions for women in the city, and because they want the Environmental Protection Agency--

SCHULTZ: Yes.

SANDERS: -- not to be able to enforce federal law with regard to greenhouse gas emissions.

SCHULTZ: And, Senator, it"s not only Planned Parenthood. I mean, to the environment, the climate folks out there who are in denial, this prohibits funding for EPA efforts to regulate greenhouse gases, prohibits funding for the EPA to change a rule regulating water. This list of over 60 riders, what"s your response to this? Is this just a blocking back for the Republicans right now?

SANDERS: All you can say is, you know, these guys are extremists and they are prepared, as the president said, to impact negatively the lives of many, many millions of people and it"s not only inconvenience for us. All over the world, people are saying what is going on in the United States of America? Our credibility goes down.

Soldiers--we are putting their lives on the line--will not get the paychecks that they should be getting. It is insane.

(CROSSTALK)

SCHULTZ: -- the president did not mention that vote in the House today. What do you make of that, Congresswoman?

SCHAKOWSKY: Oh, the fact that they passed $12 billion more in cuts, they have all those social agenda pieces added to their proposal and Eric Cantor stood up on the floor--and I"m telling you, the Tea Party members, they were just frothing at the mouth. I thought they were going to start yelling, "Shut down, shut down," because he was saying they"re just not going to leave until they get these additional cuts and that they"re not going to stand for the status quo because the Democrats offered to say, let"s just extend it for a week without any additional cuts or any additional items and we"ll negotiate that.

They don"t want to negotiate. The Tea Party people want to shut it down.

But I do believe it is at their peril. The game has changed. The narrative is changing out there, and I think that the American people don"t want dirty air and dirty water, and they don"t want to have Planned Parenthood that serves one out of five American women in their lifetime to not have the funding. They don"t like this.

I think the Republicans have a lot to lose if they don"t--aren"t willing to negotiate.

SCHULTZ: The question is, is the--are the extremists in the Republican Party guiding the ship right now for John Boehner and just how far will he go? He surprised a lot of people today when he was talking about saying that there"s no daylight between him and the Tea Party. Here it is.

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REP. JOHN BOEHNER (R-OH), SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: I"m going to fight for the best deal I can for my team.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know what the Democrats say? They say they could cut a deal with you but you won"t buck the Tea Party.

BOEHNER: Listen, there"s no daylight between the Tea Party and me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: None?

BOEHNER: None. They want us to deal with this crushing debt that"s going to crush the future for our kids and grandkids. There"s no daylight there.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Senator, what do you make of that?

SANDERS: Ed, we should be very clear, I think Boehner is right in saying that. And everybody must understand, this is just the beginning. If you look at Congressman Ryan"s budget that he has proposed, we"re talking about the end of Medicare as we know it, massive cuts in Medicaid, we"re talking about devastating cutbacks in Pell grants and education, environmental protection.

What these guys are doing is dismantling all of the programs that were put in place in the last 70 years to protect working families and lower income people, children and the sick.

SCHAKOWSKY: And they"re doing that in order to be able to give more tax breaks to the wealthiest Americans who have been the only ones who have been benefited over the last several years. And the tradeoff--Medicare? Or do we give more tax cuts to millionaires and billionaires.

I don"t think that is popular with the American--we know that it isn"t. The American people have already weighed in on the Medicare issue and said, no way, we don"t want that.

SCHULTZ: All right. Finally to both of you, Congresswoman, percentage wise on a shutdown -- 50-50, 90-10 percent, is there going to be one? What do you think?

SCHAKOWSKY: Oh, right now, I think--I"m going to guess 60-40 shutdown.

SCHULTZ: Sixty/forty shutdown. What do you say, Senator Sanders?

SANDERS: No idea. Your guess is as good as mine.

SCHULTZ: Well, the president said tonight he"s not ready to express any wild optimism although he expects an answer in the morning. So, they"ll be working all night long on this. Let"s see how far Mr. Boehner will go. Let"s see if the Democrats will give up anymore.

Congresswoman Jan Schakowsky and Senator Bernie Sanders, good to have you with us tonight. Thanks so much.

SCHAKOWSKY: Thank you.

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