MSNBC "The Ed Show" - Transcript

Interview

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REP. JERRY NADLER (D), NEW YORK: Well, there are two things to say, first of all, the United States has always considered waterboarding torture except during the Bush administration. We prosecuted Japanese generals for waterboarding people. We prosecuted American soldiers for waterboarding people and pressed that cage. The current attorney general Mr. Holder has said that waterboarding is torture. We"ve always regarded it as torture and under our statute, under our international law, we are bound to prosecute. The president has a duty under the constitution to take care the laws of faith to be executed and now that former President Bush said that he personally ordered waterboarding, there must be at least an investigation and a special prosecutor.

SCHULTZ: So is that sound bite and the book indict the president in your opinion?

NADLER: It absolutely indicts the president. Secondly, he said that it saved lives. Well there"s no evidence of that whatsoever, there is considerable and we had in front of my subcommittee and at any number of CIA and FBI agents come in and testify that quite the contrary, we learned a lot more from different kinds of psychological techniques and not from torture but second of all, we do know that use of torture has been a major recruiting tool for Al Qaeda and for others who were killing American troops. And thirdly.

SCHULTZ: Yes.

NADLER: .this will provide a purchase justification, excuse, for anybody who wants to harm American troops and may be captured in the future.

SCHULTZ: This is real, genuine new information, in your opinion, and you"re asking attorney general Eric Holder to do this. Do you think he"ll do it? And do you think this is the smoking gun?

NADLER: Well, it is a smoking gun. I"m dubious that he will do it because this administration, unfortunately, has taken the opinion--has taken the attitude that they"re not going to look at any criminal actions within the prior administration. They say, let"s look forward, not backward, by that standard no one would ever prosecute any crime and this is a violation of our obligations under the torture treaty, under the torture convention, that Ronald Reagan signed.

SCHULTZ: Well, you got the attention of your colleague Peter King. He has just responded to Politico saying that, he thinks President Bush deserves credit here, he saved lives, in fact he should get a medal for what he did. Your response?

NADLER: Well as I said, there"s no evidence that that saved lives other than the president"s self-serving statement. And no one should get a medal for violating the law, the United States has always considered waterboarding torture. This administration says, it considers waterboarding torture. Torture is illegal and it"s the end of that.

SCHULTZ: Congressman Nadler, quickly, what do you think the attorney general is going to do? Will he pay attention to this? Will he respond?

NADLER: Judging by the record of this attorney general, he will not pay attention, he will not respond.

SCHULTZ: OK. Congressman.

NADLER: And that is shameful.

SCHULTZ: It is. And you say it"s shameful, well doesn"t that go right to the president"s desk?

NADLER: Well, that"s up to him.

SCHULTZ: Congressman, good to have you with us tonight. Thank you.

NADLER: Thank you.

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