MSNBC "The Rachel Maddow Show" - Transcript

Interview

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Joining us now is Democratic Senator Ron Wyden of Oregon. He"s a member of the Senate Finance Committee.

Senator Wyden, thank you very much for joining us tonight.

Appreciate it.

SEN. RON WYDEN (D), OREGON: Thank you, Rachel. We"re looking at snowpocalypse II. So, it"s pretty wild here.

MADDOW: In terms of the functioning of the Senate, is there an institutional problem in the Senate when it comes to conducting routine business in this country now?

WYDEN: I believe there is. I believe that the Senate is being hit right now by a corrosive combination. Its outmoded rules, which is what you"ve been talking about with respect to the filibuster, and it"s also excessive partisanship. And you"ve got to attack both of them.

If you don"t, for example, deal with the excessive partisanship, can you change the rules, but people will still find a way around them. You got to deal with both considerations.

MADDOW: How do you deal with excessive partisanship? Obviously, the president has been moving sort of forward aggressively in a two-pronged way, trying to embarrass people for bold partisanship when they, for example, now oppose things they used to support because the president has decided he supports them too. He"s also tried to express optimism in saying that he really believes there is a bipartisan future.

I think I"m not an optimistic person by nature and maybe that"s why I don"t see that second part of it as based in reality.

WYDEN: I got to tell you. I think we"ll have a real chance on February 25th, and the American people are sick and tired of all this gotcha politics. I think on the health care issue, which we"ll be dealing with on February 25th, the president is making it clear that he is going to reach out for common ground. There"s a lot to work with.

I think our party is right that you cannot fix this without universal coverage. You can"t fix this without getting everybody covered because, otherwise, the people who are uninsured shift their bills to the insured. I think the other party has got some valid points as well about choice and competition. We ought to make sure that everybody understands you can fire your insurance company if they don"t treat you properly.

There is a lot to work with. And what we got to get away from is zero sum politics where one side wins and the other side loses.

MADDOW: I feel like that argument, which is similar to what the president has been arguing, makes a lot of sense. It"s really only been argue from the Democratic side. It seems like on the Republican side, they"re not only not making arguments like that, but they found it to be to their political advantage to just say no, even when their policies are incorporated into the proposed legislation.

For example, they"ve said that they want tort reform to be part of health reform. As you know, tort reform efforts were incorporated into the Senate bill. They"re still complaining about tort reform, still complaining they"re going to vote against it.

Is--are you feeling like there"s anything constructive coming from Republicans on this? Or are you just asking for that?

WYDEN: I have been talking to Republicans. I"ve been talking to Democrats. And I think if both sides get together, we can, for example, say, "Let"s go after the special interests rather than each other. Let"s try to score policy points rather than political points."

Let me give you an example. The Republicans very want to allow for shopping interstate. Now, we have a very good provision in our bill. It"s called section 1333. It would allow for interstate compacts. That"s moving in the direction the Republicans want to go.

Let"s get into these policy questions. I think we can find common ground and particularly building around more choice and more competition, we can hold costs down. And that"s something that will allow both sides to say we"re putting the American people first.

MADDOW: If Republicans continue to pledge to vote no, as they have thus far. And, actually, what we"re going to be talking about with Ezra Klein in our next segment about that very section on the bill that you"re talking about, a Republican proposal adopted by those who drafted the Senate bill and something that Republicans still aren"t saying they"re going to support.

If Republicans still pledge to vote against it, despite these constructive efforts, how do you pass it anyway?

WYDEN: I"m prepared to say we are going to keep all options on the table. That includes reconciliation; that includes all options. But what I want to do is make sure--and I think this is what the president deserves credit for--let"s go to the policy high ground. Let us continue to find areas where both sides can come together.

Certainly, if the president is going to talk about areas like legal reform, I personally believe that insurance reform is absolutely critical. The system is about cherry picking. It"s about taking, essentially, the healthy people, sending sick people over to government programs more fragile than they are.

If there"s going to be an agreement around the kind of principles the president is talking about in terms of considering legal reform, let"s match it with very strong insurance reform. That"s the kind of thing that"s in the interest of the American people.

MADDOW: Senator Ron Wyden of Oregon, braving the snow tonight and showing himself to be as optimistic about the constructive nature of Washington right now, as the president is in both cases. Very impressive tonight, sir, thanks very much for your time.

WYDEN: Thank you.

MADDOW: Appreciate it.

WYDEN: Thank you.

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