MSNBC "The Ed Show" - Transcript

Interview

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Maryland Congressman Chris Van Hollen joins us tonight. He is the chairman of the DCCC, and he‘s got a smile on his face because Michele Bachmann‘s opponents raise money.

She‘s definitely a live wire that gets attention. Is this good or bad for your party? What do you think, Chris?

REP. CHRIS VAN HOLLEN (D), DCCC CHAIRMAN: Well, Ed, she is a lightening rod, which means that the people who are running against her will be able to raise lots of money. But more importantly, her voice and that of others on the far right have essentially hijacked the Republican Party. They have become the spokesmen and women for the Republican Party.

You‘ve got Michele Bachmann, a member of Congress. You‘ve got Glenn Beck. You‘ve got Rush Limbaugh.

Essentially, those voices have taken over and dominated the Republican Party to the point that they represent the views of the party because you don‘t have leadership, Republican leaders in Congress, challenging them. They allow these remarks to go unchallenged. They endorse them, in many cases.

And if you want to try and capture the Independent voter, that‘s not the way to do it, because Independent voters do not want ideologues, they do not want purity tests. They want problem solvers. And that kind of rhetoric makes it very clear that that‘s not a party of problem solvers.

SCHULTZ: It‘s interesting that Michele Bachmann is an accomplished attorney. I mean, she is a very smart person, and she has loyal, I would call them, followers.

Could she spring up, in your opinion, on the national scene for the Republican Party? Because you mentioned the people like Limbaugh, and also Beck and Lou Dobbs. I mean, they seem to prop her up any time she says something pretty outlandish and endorse her, almost to the point as if she‘s (sic) coaching her.

Do you think she has national potential?

VAN HOLLEN: Well, she does have strong followers. There‘s no doubt about it.

She organized a rally on Capitol Hill several weeks ago where you had all sorts of people coming out. We saw the signs in the crowd, pictures of the death camps in Nazi Germany, some very extreme elements that turned out.

There‘s no doubt about it, she has a very strong following. I think the danger for the Republican Party, as it was expressed, is that she and others become the voice of the Republican Party. And by virtue of the others by default, really, that is what has happened, because you have a Republican Party that has no sort of ideas and solutions of their own.

On health care, for example, the only proposals they put forward are ones that the insurance companies love. When it comes to try and deal with the financial crisis, they‘re opposing legislation that would prevent us from being held hostage by Wall Street once again, so they‘re in bed with the special interests.

So, they really don‘t have any voices out there that resonate with sort of commonsense American voters. And so, to the extent that she continues to have this merry band following her, the more the better.

SCHULTZ: Dick Armey is now in the act. He just won‘t go away. In fact, he has started a Web site, ReadTheStimulus.org petition, and you had quite an interesting exchange with him recently at a House Oversight hearing.

Here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VAN HOLLEN: You would have voted yes? I just want to make sure I understand.

DICK ARMEY, FREEDOMWORKS: I don‘t know.

VAN HOLLEN: You don‘t know?

ARMEY: I haven‘t looked at the package. I didn‘t look at the package. I never wrote it on something I didn‘t read.

VAN HOLLEN: You keep saying "If there were." Did you read the economic recovery bill?

ARMEY: No, I didn‘t.

VAN HOLLEN: You didn‘t?

ARMEY: I had no reason to read it. I wasn‘t going to vote on it.

VAN HOLLEN: Well, no. Mr. Armey, you‘ve been commenting an awful lot both here and in the press about the economic recovery bill.

ARMEY: Right.

VAN HOLLEN: We ask members of Congress to read it when they vote on it and are considering it. You‘ve said a lot about it, so I‘m a little surprised to learn that you haven‘t read it.

ARMEY: Well, look, if my neighbor‘s got a dead cat stinking up his yard, I don‘t have to know how it got there to know it‘s a dead cat stinking up the yard.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHULTZ: Now, Congressman Van Hollen, I think this is a very profound moment, because here you have Dick Armey out there pushing people like Michele Bachmann and raising money, yet he‘s not doing the due diligence of exactly what‘s going on. And I think also empowers people like Michele Bachmann to go out and say outlandish stuff.

Is this going to work with the, say, malcontents who might be motivated enough just to vote for change the other way? What do you think?

VAN HOLLEN: Well, you‘re exactly right, Ed. I mean, here‘s the guy that‘s leading, in part, the Tea Party movement. He‘s leading the whole effort that says read the bill. And what became very clear when we asked him some questions, I asked him some questions about simple things that were in the bill--for example, a tax relief for individuals and small businesses--it was pretty clear he didn‘t know what was in the bill.

SCHULTZ: So they‘re just rabblerousing in many respects. They‘re rabblerousing in many respects, and they‘re going to hook on to any type of congressional member who will go out there and just fire and fire for effect to get attention? Crazy business.

VAN HOLLEN: Well, that‘s right. Look, they‘re playing this game as if they know what‘s in this legislation. And boy, you, the American people, better be scared about it.

It turns out they don‘t know what‘s in the legislation. All they‘re doing is trying to scare people, and I think people are going to wake up to this.

I mean, when they see that the leader of the Read the Bill movement doesn‘t read the bill, doesn‘t know what‘s in the legislation, they‘ve got to ask themselves, who are these people who are following (ph) it? At least I hope that raises questions.

SCHULTZ: Congressman Van Hollen, great to have you on. Have a happy Thanksgiving. Thanks so much.

VAN HOLLEN: You, too. Happy Thanksgiving to you, Ed.

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