MSNBC "The Ed Show" - Transcript

Interview

Interviewer: Ed Schultz

SCHULTZ: Welcome back to THE ED SHOW. President Obama wants a health care reform bill on his desk by October. I think he wants it sooner than that, really, in his gut, if they can get it done. But you know, it‘s just not looking good right now, OK? Resistance from the health care industry is a real big reason why.

Insurance and drug companies don‘t want a public option. And they have a lot of cash behind them right now to knock this thing down. They‘re spending 1.4 million dollars a day to lobby the Congress. And in case all that money isn‘t enough, they‘ve hired a slew of former government staffers and retired members of the Congress to influence the lawmakers.

You know, they used to want it, but now they‘re getting paid so now they don‘t want it. Let me bring in Senator Bernie Sanders of Vermont, the independent, who tells it like it is on this issue. Is this the biggest lobbying effort, senator, that you have ever seen on any issue, or does it at least come in the top three or four?

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I), VERMONT: Well, it‘s way up there. Don‘t underestimate the power of our banks to force deregulation and the Wall Street bailout. They‘re powerful as well.

But the drug companies and the insurance companies have historically spent hundreds and hundreds of millions of dollars to make sure we remain the only country in the industrialized world without a national health care program, and that we continue to pay the highest prices for prescription drugs.

SCHULTZ: So how many lobbyists are on the Hill working offices in favor of a public option, opposed to those who are trying to strike it out of the bill?

SANDERS: Well, the pro-public option are greatly outnumbered. We have many organizations who are fighting the fight that the American people want. Ed, what we can‘t forget is what polls show. The last "New York Times" poll, 72 percent of the American people wanted a public option; 90 percent of the Democrats wanted a public option. I think about half the Republicans did.

It is incomprehensible that there should be any question about whether we have that.

The real solution, of course, is a single payer national health care program, which is the only way, by the way, that you‘re going to provide universal, comprehensive, cost-effective health care for all of our people.

SCHULTZ: So this is going to take a mammoth lift on the part of the Democrats to get this done. And maybe if you could, senator, cite another example where either party has ever beaten back the lobbyists the way they‘re going to have to beat them back on this issue, comparatively speaking.

SANDERS: I‘ve been dealing with the drug companies for many years.

They have never lost.

SCHULTZ: Never lost?

SANDERS: They‘re Rocky Marciano of lobbyists. They never lose, never, zero. That is why they can double the price of your prescription drugs tomorrow. That is why they manage to get the Medicare Part D bill through that they wrote. That is why they pay their CEOs tens and tens of millions of dollars. That is why we don‘t negotiate prices with drug companies.

They never lose. The insurance companies may occasionally lose, but they‘re also very, very powerful.

SCHULTZ: Your colleague Chuck Schumer from New York has become pretty aggressive on this issue in the last few weeks. In fact, he commented that now that Al Franken is in the Senate, there shouldn‘t be any more excuses. You agree with that?

SANDERS: Absolutely. We‘ve got 60 votes. And while I can understand that there may be some Democrats who don‘t want to vote for final passage of legislation that has a strong public plan, every single one of those 60 votes should go to stop the Republican filibuster. Republicans have broken all time worlds records in the number of filibusters they brought forth. They are a do-nothing party.

Every member of the Democratic caucus should say, sorry, you can‘t destroy our effort to bring health care to every American.

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