Hearing of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee – Nominations

Hearing of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee - Nominations

CHAIRED BY: SENATOR BARBARA BOXER (D-CA)

WITNESSES: RICHARD VERMA, NOMINEE TO BE ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF STATE FOR LEGISLATIVE AFFAIRS; MELANNE VERVEER, NOMINEE TO BE AMBASSADOR-AT-LARGE FOR WOMEN'S ISSUES, STATE DEPARTMENT; ESTHER BRIMMER, NOMINEE TO BE ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF STATE FOR INTERNATIONAL ORGANIZATION AFFAIRS

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SEN. BOXER: The committee will come to order, and we welcome our guests and our colleagues. Today the full Senate Foreign Relations Committee meets to consider the nominees, three, for important posts at the State Department. All three positions fall under the jurisdiction of a new subcommittee I'm very proud to chair covering international operations and organizations, human rights, democracy, and global women's issues.

Too often we've ignored the unique challenges that confront women and girls everywhere. It is time to bring an end to the trafficking of women and girls, to the mass rape and utter brutalization of women that's become a tool of war, and forced child marriages, to political marginalization and the denial of education that women and girls face every day in too many countries. In this century no nation can move ahead if half its citizens are left behind. I think we all agree with that. That is why I'm so pleased that we're considering -- frankly all the nominations here today, but I'm going to take them in order.

The first one will be Melanne Verveer, and I'm so pleased that she is the president's nominee to be the ambassador-at-large for global women's issues. For more than 15 years, in both governmental and nongovernmental worlds, Ms. Verveer traveled to some 80 countries, learning firsthand the difficulties that women face and the tools that they need to overcome such challenges, first as an assistant to the president and chief of staff to the first lady, as she worked to make women's issues an integral part of our foreign policy. And she helped create the president's interagency council on women. And then for the last eight years as co-founder, chairwoman, and co-chief executive of Vital Voices, a nongovernmental organization that identifies and trains and empowers emerging women leaders and social entrepreneurs around the globe. If confirmed, Ms. Verveer will be the very first person to serve in that role.

Esther Brimmer is before us to be the assistant secretary of state for international organizations. If confirmed, Ms. Brimmer will be responsible for developing and implementing U.S. policy at the U.N. and its specialized agencies and many other international, intergovernmental organizations. Ms. Brimmer is currently the deputy director and director of research at the Johns Hopkins School of Advanced International Studies, Center for Transatlantic Relations. After receiving her education at Pomona College -- I'm proud to say in my home state -- and later at Oxford, Ms. Brimmer established herself as a prolific scholar of international affairs. She's worked at the State Department, serving in the office of policy planning, and in the officer of the undersecretary for political affairs.

If confirmed, Ms. Brimmer will clearly have her work cut out for her. As I've said many times before, while I acknowledge the U.N. is far from perfect, I do support a strong U.S. leadership role there to tackle issues such as terrorism, the proliferation of nuclear weapons, HIV/AIDS, tuberculosis and malaria, development and security for displaced persons, climate change, and countless other issues. These issues are very large and we need to work with the world, and you will help us, Ms. Brimmer.

And finally, we're considering the nomination of Richard Verma to be the assistant secretary of state for legislative affairs. If confirmed, Mr. Verma will be responsible for the coordination of all legislative activity for the Department of State and all communication between the State Department and Congress, and I frankly believe he is very well suited for this task, having worked with him in the recent past.

Mr. Verma is currently a partner in the firm Steptoe & Johnson here in D.C. He recently served on the Obama-Biden transition team, but he's perhaps best known for the role he played as senior national security adviser to minority and later Majority Leader Harry Reid, where he fielded countless questions, certainly from me and many others, an experience that I know will serve him very well. Mr. Verma also spent four years on active duty in the U.S. Air Force, for which we also thank you.

With that said, I look forward to hearing prepared remarks from each of you. I certainly look forward to hearing from my colleague, Senator Wicker. We're hoping you'd each keep your statements to five minutes, and you can submit longer statements for the record. I also welcome each of your distinguished guests to give their introduction. We're very proud to see Senator Hutchison here. I almost said governor, but that's in the future. (Laughter.) Senator Hutchison here. And of course Congresswoman Eleanor Norton.

So at this time -- and I'd ask the distinguished guests if they would keep their intros to three minutes if you can. I know it's hard, but if you can't, it's okay. But I would like to now turn to our distinguished ranking member, Senator Wicker, for any comments he may have.

SENATOR ROGER WICKER (R-MS): Thank you, Madame Chair, and let me observe, this is a meeting of the full committee but it's being presided over by the chairman of the subcommittee on international operations and organizations, democracy and human rights, international women's issues, my colleague Senator Boxer. And this is my first opportunity to be at a meeting wherein I'm serving as your ranking member. And let me just observe that Barbara Boxer has been my friend for several years, well before I became a member of the United States Senate, and I have always enjoyed working with her and discussing matters with her.

We don't always agree on issues, but when we disagree we disagree cheerfully. But it might surprise members of the committee and the general public that actually there are quite a number of issues on which we do agree, and I look forward to working on this committee.

I do have a prepared statement and I'll try to summarize if I can. I think I get five minutes per nominee, don't I?

SEN. BOXER: Whatever you want.

SEN. WICKER: And I think the record should reflect, Senator Hutchison, that you've just been endorsed for governor by Barbara Boxer. (Laughter.)

SEN. BOXER: I certainly wouldn't ever give an endorsement without her permission.

SEN. WICKER: Fortunately, all these nominees have long and distinguished careers, and correspondingly they deserve the most careful consideration and scrutiny by this committee. As you're well aware, Madame Chair, the assistant secretary of state for legislative affairs serves as the principal liaison between the Department of State and the Congress.

Serves as the principal adviser to the secretary of state for congressional affairs, coordinates testimony for Department of State officials, and serves as an advocate for the department's policy to Congress. As such an effective nominee for the position should already enjoy knowledge of congressional affairs through practices and a good working relationship with members of Congress and their staffs.

In my opinion Richard Verma represents an excellent choice for this position. Mr. Verma's four years of service as the senior national security adviser for Senator Harry Reid demonstrates his experience at effectively working with Congress. This is also underscored by his work as a staff assistant for Congressman Murtha in the early 1990s. I have every hope and confidence that he will continue his productive working relationship with Congress.

I would also like to take note of and acknowledge Mr. Verma's work on the Commission on the Prevention of Weapons of Mass Destruction, Proliferation, and Terrorism. The book that Mr. Verma co-authored during his tenure on the commission, entitled "World at Risk," is a stark and sobering reminder of the continuing danger that these weapons pose, particularly at the hands of terrorists and state sponsors of terrorism.

In addition, as an Air Force veteran myself I'd be remiss if I neglected to mention Mr. Verma's service in that distinguished pre- eminent organization in the Department of Defense. Mr. Verma helped defend our country as an active duty Air Force officer from 1994 to 1998, and served as an Air Force Reservist from 1998 to 2006, after which he was honorably discharged.

To sum it up, I believe Mr. Verma will make an excellent assistant secretary of state for legislative affairs.

We're also here to consider the nomination of Ms. Verveer to be ambassador-at-large for women's global issues. It is important that the United States serve as a consistent and effective advocate for women. This includes making a priority of advancing full equality and civil rights for women in our diplomatic outreach. U.S. diplomats should carefully review the status of women in other countries, and when governments are clearly discriminating against women, should make this an issue in our bilateral relationships as well as championing the cause of women in multilateral relationships. The addition of this issue to the jurisdiction of this subcommittee speaks to this importance and is a tribute to the chair of the subcommittee for her persistence in that regard.

The U.S. must work to promote political and economic opportunities for women. U.S. diplomats need to engage with foreign women's organizations to empower them to improve their own circumstances and that of their countries, and we must also look to other parts of the world. China's one-child policy in which each Chinese married couple is permitted to have only a single child is in practice frequently used by the Chinese government to undertake coerced abortions and sterilizations of Chinese women. We should condemn this practice in the strongest possible terms. The administration should also carefully review the funding that it plans to provide to the United Nations population fund, UNFPA, to ensure it does not indirectly support this practice.

Another U.S. priority should be the reduction of the use of rape as a weapon of war. I know this is an issue of great concern to Senator Boxer also. While armies have used rape as a weapon throughout the entire history of warfare, it has only recently come to be systematically documented. In recent years there have been numerous reports and allegations of the use of rape during conflicts in Bosnia and Herzegovina, the Democratic Republic of Congo, Colombia, and Sudan. The ambassador needs to investigate these reports when they occur, and organize the government's efforts against them.

Lastly I'd like to say a few words about the trafficking in persons, a crime that disproportionately affects women. The Council of Europe states that human trafficking has reached epidemic proportions in the past decade, with a global annual market of about $42.5 billion in human trafficking. Women and children are frequently abducted or lured under false pretenses across borders, where they are then forced into prostitution or slavery. Traffickers and persons are frequently members of large criminal organizations, increasing the difficulty for governments to reduce the problem. The Department of State needs to redouble its efforts to combat this issue.

Addressing these very important but considerable issues is a herculean and very necessary task and I applaud Ms. Verveer's desire to step in and address them. Her resume reflects a broad amount of experience, much of which has been done to advance women as leaders. That is quite laudable, and I would like to thank the nominee for those efforts.

I do have concerns regarding the nomination. These concerns are not about Ms. Verveer's qualifications or level of professionalism, but about what can be construed as a potential agenda for Ms. Verveer, should she be confirmed for the job. I'm pro-life, but I understand there are a number of people in this room and across the country who don't share that view. But the position of ambassador-at-large for women's global issues needs to represent all Americans, both pro-life and pro-choice. Accordingly the appropriate nominee needs to demonstrate that she will adequately take into account and represent the position of a substantial portion of the U.S. population who are pro-life.

Make no mistake, I encourage all citizens to express and act upon their political views. However, the title ambassador confers a particular responsibility to represent the U.S. internationally. As such, the incumbent has a special responsibility to ensure that her agenda represents a broad consensus of the American people and not a narrow political agenda. I hope that in her testimony Ms. Verveer can assuage any concerns by effectively assuring the committee that she would not use her position to promote abortion internationally, should she be confirmed.

And finally, Madame Chairman, I would like to speak to the position of assistant secretary of state for international organization affairs. This position carries with it a great deal of responsibility and never more so than today. Of course the most important responsibility the assistant secretary has is the formulation of effective U.S. policy toward the United Nations. I expect that this would be an extraordinarily difficult task in the years ahead. Madame Chairman, the creation of the U.N. was an American initiative, and as such we bear a particular responsibility to make sure the U.N. lives up to its founding ideals. Unfortunately, the U.N. has all too frequently fallen short of its promise in recent years.

I would like to highlight some instances where the U.N. needs to do better. First, I'd like to draw attention to the United Nations Population Fund. Legitimate concerns persist with regard to whether this organization has played a role in funding or otherwise supporting coerced abortions or forced sterilizations of women worldwide. President Obama recently announced that he plans to work with Congress to restore U.S. funding to this organization. I have significant reservations about whether we should take this step without first adequately resolving these concerns. Be that as it may, it is the responsibility of the next assistant secretary of state for international organizations that U.S. taxpayer money not go to support these odious practices of coerced abortion and forced sterilization.

It's clear that the U.N.'s mandate of ensuring global peace and stability is needed now more than ever. The world's problems grow ever more serious. Iran's reckless and dangerous pursuit of nuclear weapons, the continued threat of terrorism, the international economic crisis, the proliferation of weapons of mass destruction, and other armaments. The U.N. can play a positive role in resolving all of these issues, but U.S. leadership is essential in ensuring that we do so.

Fortunately Ms. Brimmer is an excellent nominee. She has a long career in international relations, an experience that will put her in good standing should the Senate see fit to confirm her as assistant secretary.

And I thank you, Madame Chairman, for your indulgence.

SEN. BOXER: Thank you. Well, I was a little taken aback by that statement -- I love the part about how we like each other and work together, but I just don't see foreign relations through the lens of abortion. I think if you look at the problems of the world and, you know, you ask most people in these struggling nations, they'll talk about poverty, war, rape, and the rest. But I do think there are ways we can work together on that to reduce, to reduce the number of abortions, and that is through family planning. And I always hope we can work together on that so that we can find that common ground.

Now this is how we're going to proceed because we have so many esteemed people sitting in front of me. So this is what I'd like to do. I'd like to ask each of you from Richard on down who are up, to introduce your families quickly so we can thank them for being here. And then we'll start with Senator Reid. We're going to go to Senator Hutchison, and if Senator Casey doesn't mind, can I move to Congresswoman Eleanor Holmes-Norton, and you can close. And then you can go about your business and we can get down to our business of hearing from our nominees, okay?

So let's start with you, Richard. Do you have any family or friends you want to introduce?

MR. VERMA: Sure. I appreciate that, Senator Boxer. I'd like to introduce my wife Pinky and my daughter Zoe.

SEN. BOXER: Can we see you, Pinky, stand up for us, please? Hi, beautiful girl.

MR. VERMA: She has a cold. My parents are here. My sister Anita is here. My sister Rita, her husband Bill, her daughter Nisha, and her son Brad are here. My brother Richy, her daughter Sonia are here. And hopefully I didn't forget anybody. (Laughter.)

SEN. BOXER: That's wonderful. I know they're very, very proud of you.

And yes, Melanne Verveer?

MS. VERVEER: I am joined here today by my husband, Bill.

SEN. BOXER: Bill, can you stand?

MS. VERVEER: And my daughter Alexa and her husband, Dominic Bianci (ph), and my two wonderful granddaughters, Lee and Evan.

SEN. BOXER: Could you stand up and let us take a look at you? Thank you.

Yes, Esther?

MS. BRIMMER: Thank you, Madame Chair. I would like to take a moment to introduce my family, please. My parents are here, Doris and Andrew Brimmer. My husband, Steven Beller (ph), and our son Nathaniel Brimmer-Beller is here. And I'd also like to say thank you to all my friends who are here.

SEN. BOXER: Well, you know, Senator Wicker and I agree wholeheartedly that it takes a family to stand behind all of us, so we thank the families for making the sacrifice. And I know it's a very proud day for you all.

So let's get started with Senator Reid. We're so honored to have you here, Mr. Majority Leader. We know your schedule is beyond busy. So please go ahead, speak as long as you like, and then as soon as you're done we know you have to leave, and I know the same for my colleagues.

SENATOR HARRY REID (D-NV): Madame Chair, Senator Wicker, we're so fortunate that someone like Rich Verma would agree to do public service. This is a unique individual. I've had a lot of people work for me over the years but he is in a class of his own. As you know, senators, we as United States senators rely on our staff to help so many different areas of expertise. They do all the work that we would do if we had the time and the expertise to do what they do. I am fortunate to have relied on Rich Verma, who served as my national security adviser and senior staff member from 2002 until just last year. Frankly -- he introduced his family. For me, I was happy for him and his wife Pinky, which I like that name so much because some of you know that's what I was known as as a little boy. But for me it was a loss when he started having too many children to survive on a Senate salary and he had to go get a job. So I'm glad he's going to come back in public service.

I recommend him to this committee without any reservation. He actually has been blessed with an exceptionally bright mind and a keen intellect. He will approach the nation's problems, and there are so many daunting challenges that await him, with thought, care, and wisdom. He comes from a remarkable family. He's introduced his family. His mom and dad met in India, where they both worked as school principals for local high schools. Rich's father moved to the United States in 1963 to do graduate work in Iowa. Two years later Rich's mother and the children came over to the United States.

His father is a long-time professor of English literature at the University of Pittsburgh in a good system. His mother is now retired after years as a social worker and a special education teacher. Rich left Johnstown, Pennsylvania as a young man to join the United States Air Force, where he served with distinction. He was in the judge advocate's corps, received military honors, the meritorious service medal, Air Force commendation medal, national defense service medal. Has a commission on the prevention of weapons of mass destruction, which was led, chaired by our former colleague Senator Graham of Florida. At this commission on the prevention of weapons of mass destruction, proliferation and terrorism, he co-authored the commission report, entitled "The World at Risk." This was done just last year.

On my staff he advised me on all major national security issues for five years, including implementation of 9/11 Commission recommendations, the GI Bill of Rights, body armor, dwell time, expanding the size of our army, and other initiatives by our men and women in uniform with the support they need. He was also a key adviser to me on the food crisis in Africa and other humanitarian issues that developed.

Along the way Rich has worked closely with members of the House and Senate and their staff on both sides of the aisle, as well as the executive branch and outside experts. It's fair to say that he's won the respect of virtually every colleague who has had the pleasure of working with him. There's no question that part of Rich's tremendous professional attitude has derived from his time in the military. He understands the realities of battle and he'll bring that understanding to bear on his work in the State Department.

He is clear-eyed about the task at hand, an excellent writer. He understands the critical need to maintain a military capable of defending America's interests abroad and protecting American lives here at home. He'll be a tremendous asset to President Obama, Secretary Clinton, as they rebuild a new foreign policy that restores America's moral authority abroad.

It really is, as I've already indicated, my pleasure and honor to recommend to this committee my friend, long-time adviser, Richard Verma.

SEN. BOXER: Thank you so much, Senator. We thank you for coming, and we know that you have other duties. We thank you.

Senator Hutchison.

SEN. KAY BAILEY HUTCHISON (R-TX): Thank you very much, Madame Chairman, and Senator Wicker. I'm pleased to be here today to introduce Melanne Verveer, the president's nominee to serve as ambassador-at-large for global women's issues. I've come to know Melanne through our work together at Vital Voices, an outstanding bipartisan, nongovernmental organization that helps provide women throughout the world with the skills to unlock their leadership potential. It's an organization at the forefront of efforts to improve living conditions for women, and therefore men as well.

In 2000 Melanne co-founded Vital Voices, and since then she has served as chairman of the board. For the past eight years I have been privileged to serve as honorary co-chair of Vital Voices, with then- Senator Hillary Clinton. The Vital Voices motto is, invest in women, improve the world. From the start, Vital Voices recognized and incorporated as part of their core mission the view that the best way to confront and bring about change in the world's most repressive regimes is to educate women and encourage their economic and political autonomy.

For the past nine years, thanks in large part to Melanne's leadership, that is what Vital Voices has done. They have trained and mentored more than 5,000 emerging women leaders from over 150 countries, such as in Asia, Africa, Eurasia, Latin America, and the Middle East. The women that they have trained and mentored, now over 1,000, have gone through their communities to become the vital voices of our time.

Knowing that Melanne was widely respected for her expertise and bipartisan approach, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice reached out to her on several critical initiatives in advancing our public policy, human rights, and Middle East outreach. She also helped structure the Women Leaders Forum that Secretary Rice engaged that included female foreign ministers and heads of state committed to highlighting these critical issues.

Just last week I stood with Melanne, Secretary Clinton, and others at Vital Voices' 2009 global leadership awards to honor women leaders from Afghanistan, the Democratic Republic of Congo, and Cambodia, women whose courage and vision have opened new doors for women in those troubled countries. I'm especially proud of the work we did with Melanne on women's rights in Afghanistan. Just after the fall of the Taliban regime, Senator Mikulski and I introduced the Afghan Women and Children's Relief Act of 2001. We were joined by 12 other women senators as original co-sponsors. The bill was passed unanimously in the Senate and the House and signed into law by President Bush on December 12, 2001.

The purpose of that legislation was to establish in law that it would be American policy to provide outreach to the women and children of Afghanistan by providing educational opportunities to jump-start their recovery from the years of oppressive Taliban rule. Vital Voices worked with a wide spectrum of leaders, including former secretary of state Rice and former first lady Laura Bush to educate and lift the women and children of Afghanistan. One of those programs in Afghanistan for which Melanne provided leadership was Vital Voices' three-year back-to-work, back-to-school program for women and girls. Completed in 2004, the program employed 136 Afghan women and provided them with good wages, for many the only source of income for their families. Their work enabled 35,000 girls to attend school.

Melanne was key to the Vital Voices effort to develop a leadership and legislative training skills initiative to equip newly elected women parliamentarians with the skills, opportunities and networks they need to legislate more effectively. Today, thanks in part to Vital Voices, there are 68 elected Afghan women in the 249- seat lower house of parliament and six women in the upper house.

I know that Melanne has the passion, determination, and leadership ability to be an effective global advocate for women. She is unquestionably the best person to serve as America's first-ever ambassador-at-large for global women's issues. I know that her work will improve women's rights, and by that raise the economic and social conditions for both men and women in every country. I recommend her to my colleagues for confirmation. Thank you.

SEN. BOXER: Thank you so much, Senator. We really appreciate your spending so much time with us, and we know that you're going to go on to your work. We thank you.

And Congresswoman Eleanor Holmes-Norton, it's an honor to have you before this body. I remember working with you closely in the House and admire your work.

DELEGATE ELEANOR HOLMES-NORTON (D-DC): Thank you, Madame Chairman. We do miss you. And Mr. Wicker, this is a proud opportunity for me to introduce Dr. Esther Diane Brimmer, a native Washingtonian, who the president has nominated for the important post of assistant secretary of state for international organizations. No one who knows the distinguished family from which Dr. Brimmer comes can be surprised that there is a second doctor Brimmer, or that she would have staked out her career in public service, while being a mother of course and a woman who was raising a family as well.

She was educated here and at Pomona and Oxford, and then pursued a career in the legislative and executive branches and in educational institutions -- at McKenzie, at Carnegie, at the State Department, where she held two posts. Splendidly prepared for the post that President Obama has nominated her to fill. I'm proud to recommend her to you and to strongly recommend her -- that you in fact follow through with the president's nomination.

SEN. BOXER: Thank you so very much. And again, we know you have a hectic schedule. Thank you. And so we'll finish our special honored guests at the table with our very own Senator Casey. We're happy to see you here.

SENATOR ROBERT CASEY (D-PA): Madame Chairwoman, thank you very much for this opportunity, and Senator Wicker as well. It's my privilege today to introduce Melanne Verveer, the president's nominee for the newly created position of ambassador-at-large for global women's issues. The creation of this position signals a shift in U.S. foreign policy where the State Department formally recognizes the empowerment of women that can enhance prospects for democratic reforms and economic prosperity.

I think it bears mention and attention, the horrific suffering around the world that so many women endure today, and I'm happy to be sitting next to someone who can have a positive impact and bring some light to that darkness in the lives of so many women the world over. I can't think of anyone better to serve as the first ambassador-at- large for global women's initiatives than Melanne. A dedicated advocate of women's rights and a daughter of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, I'm proud to say.

Today she is joined by her husband Phil and her daughter and other members of her family that you just met. We're honored to have them here today. We welcome them, and I know they must be immensely proud of her work, as I'm sure they've been proud of other work she's done in a lifetime of service.

This commitment to service that Melanne possesses is, I believe, the result of a lot of things in her life. There are a lot of reasons for it, but one of the reasons I believe is that it's a direct result of the values instilled in her at a very young age. She grew up in the close-knit community of Shamokin, Pennsylvania, about 80 miles from my hometown of Scranton. And I know something about the coal region of Pennsylvania. We don't mine coal there any more, but a lot of the values that were instilled in so many families at that time still remain with us. In the coal region I believe we share a history and a heritage of hard work and sacrifice, and she learned that as a young girl. It's also a caring community, where in the difficult days when people were working in the mines and if someone died in the mine, they would literally throw the body if someone died right on the front porch and let the family take care of it. The family unit in those communities had to come together before the protections of government and other institutions. So I know she understands what a community that comes together can do, working together to protect people from exploitation or abuse and to eliminate as best we can any suffering.

It's important to know her educational background. After receiving her undergraduate and graduate degrees from Georgetown University, she went on to spend the next few decades working in government and in the nonprofit sector. I have to say in a personal way, as a father, my wife Therese and I have four daughters for whom an accomplished woman like Melanne has set a wonderful example. We're especially honored today to strongly endorse her to be our first ambassador-at-large for global women's issues.

If you don't mind, I want to share some of the stage with another Pennsylvanian for two minutes. I know I wasn't supposed to do this, but I do want to say how much I appreciate the fact that the president, just as in the case of both Ms. Brimmer and Melanne, has recognized the great opportunity for service that Richard Verma possesses, as assistant secretary for legislative affairs. As our majority leader told us already, Richard is a proud native of Johnstown, Pennsylvania, and I'm happy to say that. From his days at Lehigh to the Air Force to his work with Congressman Jack Murtha, and so many other capacities, most recently on behalf of Majority Leader Reid, we know the great service that Rich has provided. We're happy that you're here and willing to serve and we're so grateful that your family is here to celebrate this day.

In both cases, in all three cases we're grateful for their service, and I'm the last speaker. Thanks very much.

SEN. BOXER: Senator, we want to thank you so very much. And I take your endorsement of this panel. But I want to say particularly of Melanne.

I think it's going to really help her in this because you've come to us as the proud father of four and someone who is proudly pro-life as well. Your helping her, I think, just cuts through it all and it's very important. So thank you so very much. We know that you want to go about your business too. We thank you.

And I guess we'll start with you, Richard, and we'll move down to Melanne and then to Esther. So go right ahead.

MR. VERMA: Thank you, Madame Chairwoman, Senator Wicker. If you'll allow me just to take a minute, I knew as soon as I started introducing people I'd forget somebody. My nephew Sanjeve (ph) is here as well. (Laughter.)

SEN. BOXER: Sanjeve, we welcome you.

MR. VERMA: I do appreciate the opportunity to appear before you today. This is a great honor for me, but also a somewhat unusual experience, as I am more comfortable and accustomed to sitting in the staff chairs behind you rather than at the witness table. In many ways I still consider myself a congressional staffer, and if confirmed I will certainly take that mind-set into the job.

Let me also thank the president and Secretary Clinton for nominating me and asking me to serve in this position. I was humbled to have been asked, and you have my commitment that I will work very hard to live up to the high standards and expectations that the administration and this committee have set.

Let me also thank Senator Reid. I was privileged to work for him, and I can think of no finer boss or mentor. I know the state of Nevada and the country have been the beneficiary of his many decades of public service.

As the secretary said during her confirmation hearing, these are historic times with enormous and complex global challenges before us. From terrorism to climate change to poverty and disease, to the international financial turmoil and ongoing conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan, the foreign policy and security challenges facing this country loom large. Combating these challenges will require the full arsenal of U.S. power, or "smart power" as the secretary and others call it, and the State Department will be a major player in these efforts.

This will require the State Department to play an increasingly larger and more demanding role in its diplomatic and development efforts around the globe. Clearly these increased roles, missions, and budgetary needs must be coordinated with and ultimately supported by the Congress if we are to achieve true success. I can commit to you that I will do everything I can to build a true partnership between the committees of jurisdiction and the State Department as policies are debated and formulated and additional resources are secured.

As you know, the job of assistant secretary for legislative affairs is not a policy job. It is in large measure a liaison job, running the bureau that facilitates the exchange of information between the executive and legislative branches. It is the bureau that helps the Congress and the State Department carry out their shared constitutional responsibilities in the oversight and execution of U.S. foreign policy. My default position will be to share information with you, to consult widely, to be as responsive to your needs as possible, and to be nonpartisan in the way in which we approach our mission. From facilitating an exchange of ideas on major foreign policy issues, to helping a constituent with a lost passport, you will be able to count on the Bureau of Legislative Affairs for help. Given that the secretary is a former senator and I'm a former staffer, I can assure you that this relationship with the Congress will be of paramount importance. We know that only with timely and accurate information can you do your jobs effectively, and I am committed to providing you with that information.

In closing, I want to again thank the president and the secretary for their confidence. Let me also thank my wife Pinky and my children for supporting yet another stint at public service. And also my mother and father and my entire family for the support they have provided me. My father has that somewhat classic immigrant story, arriving from India in New York City in 1963, with only a bus ticket and $24 in his wallet. With no other resources, support systems, or networks in place he still went on to earn his masters, Ph.D., and become a full professor while he and my mom raised five kids in their new home country. I know I am only here today because of their efforts and because of so many friends and mentors along the way who gave me a chance and allowed me to stand on their shoulders.

If confirmed, I will not let them down. If confirmed, I will also be grateful to be part of an extraordinary team of State Department public servants who have committed themselves to making the United States that shining beacon of hope and prosperity to millions around the world, the one that drew my parents here over 45 years ago.

Thank you again for the time and opportunity to be here today, and I look forward to answering your questions.

SEN. BOXER: Thank you so much, Richard. Melanne?

MS. VERVEER: Thank you, Senator. Madame Chairman and Senator Wicker, thank you for the opportunity to appear before you today. It has particular significance to me since, Senator Boxer, you are now heading up a subcommittee which has had its focus expanded to include global women's issues. The president's decision to nominate an ambassador-at-large for these issues is also unprecedented, and I think reflects their elevated importance to him and his administration.

I am humbled by the trust that he and the secretary of state have placed in me, and if confirmed I look forward to coordinating our country's foreign policy programs on behalf of women and girls.

I want to express my deep appreciation to Senators Hutchison and Casey for their generous introductions, and to thank my dear family, who are here with me, and my son and daughter who could not be here for their enduring love and support.

The position to which I have been nominated has to do with women, but these issues should not be considered solely or uniquely women's issues, for if women's potential is developed and they participate fully in their societies, it is our world that will prosper. The major economic, security, governance, and environmental challenges of our times cannot be solved without the participation of women at all levels of society. Investing in women is one of the most powerful forces for reshaping the globe, and as yet one that is significantly untapped.

During my previous years in government I was privileged to work with then-First Lady Hillary Clinton and to travel with her throughout the developing world, from Nepal to Nicaragua, on her tireless efforts to raise the status of women. She frequently reminded those in positions of power wherever she went that global progress depends on the progress of women and girls. Democratic institutions cannot thrive and survive without their participation. Economies cannot grow and prosper without their inclusion. And it remains a simple fact, as you said, Senator Boxer, that no country can get ahead if half of its citizens are left behind.

Women are still the great majority of the poor around the globe. Girls make up two-thirds of the unschooled. Violence against women is a global scourge. The AIDS pandemic has a woman's face. Too many women still die in pregnancy and childbirth, and countless others are victims of rape used as a tool of war. There are still too few women in the village councils, the halls of parliaments, and at the tables of power addressing conflict resolution, places where the decisions that affect them and their families and societies are being made without their participation. Raising the status of women would go a long way to keeping states from failing and terrorists from succeeding.

Despite the pace, there has been progress, and today more and more women are advancing social, economic, and political change for the betterment of their societies. At Vital Voices I have seen firsthand how investing in women is a high yield investment. The president and secretary of state recognize the imperative of integrating women's issues into U.S. foreign policy; that will require greater coordination and collaboration on priorities and activities with the regional and functional bureaus, USAID, and other entities.

During my previous service in government, I have been privileged to work with our dedicated and resourceful State Department career officials.

They have recognized and actively promoted investments in women to achieve America's goals and our challenge will be to develop more strategic and effective ways to do so. Investing in women is a prudent decision and should be at the core of any foreign policy strategy to strengthen democracy, protect human rights, grow economies, attack disease, and achieve peace and security. With the asset of the senate, I will work energetically to advance that goal and in so doing America's global leadership -- thank you.

SEN. BOXER: Thank you so much, Melanne.

And Esther Brimmer?

MS. BRIMMER: Thank you Madame Chairwoman; ranking member Wicker, thank you. Distinguished members of the committee, it is an honor and a privilege to appear before you as the president's nominee to be Assistant Secretary of State for International Organizations Affairs. I thank the president for his confidence in me in naming me to this position; Secretary Clinton for her support; and Ambassador Wright for her encouragement and wise counsel. It is with abiding humility and deep commitment to serve my country that I contemplate this challenging assignment. Throughout my career I have focused on international security issues in multilateral settings. I have served in government, studied policy while in the think-tank community, and I've worked on the Hill -- albeit in the other place -- but I appreciate that American foreign policy benefits from a positive relationship between the executive and legislative branches.

I would like to thank Congresswoman Eleanor Holmes Norton for introducing me; as she said, I'm a Washingtonian but I should probably let Senator Casey know I was born in Philadelphia in the University Hospital -- (laughter) -- (inaudible). I grew up here surrounded by people dedicated to public service, starting with my father, and I'm delighted that my family can be here today and for all of their support over so many years.

I was a child in the civil rights era. Can we make a difference? Yes we can. I've seen my parents and my grandparents in their own ways break down barriers to help America reach its potential. In each generation we find our own best way to contribute. My parents were on The Mall and heard Martin Luther King give the "I have a Dream" speech in 1963 -- and four decades later my husband and I stood on that Mall with our son, who is in sixth grade studying American history, and we heard Barack Obama inaugurated as the 44th President of The United States. President Obama has an updated -- a new -- vision of U.S. leadership in international affairs to strengthen our common security by investing in our common humanity. Revitalizing cooperation will play an important part in that effort.

The president has reaffirmed America's commitment to The United Nations as an indispensable, if imperfect, institution for advancing our security and well-being. We face new and fast-moving challenges on a daunting array of issues that no one state can address effectively alone. Besides it's 10 internal offices in Washington, the International Organization's Bureau supports the U.S. mission in New York and six overseas missions. All told, this comprises 617 hard-working people with a major impact on multilateral programs.

Multilateral diplomacy, of course, is not the only tool available to us. I appreciate the need to dovetail these efforts with the bilateral work of our embassies, our public diplomacy, the U.S. military, and other government agencies. Nor does being an effective part of the UN mean surrendering our sovereignty. Secretary Clinton and others have summed up this multi-faceted approach with the term: "smart power" -- using the full range of tools at our disposal to advance American interests and promote a more peaceful, prosperous, and democratic world; this places diplomacy at the leading edge of international relations.

When thinking about the U.N., our focus is often on intractable, politically charged issues debated at The Security Council or The General Assembly. But the U.N. system is comprised of many agencies and organizations quietly trying to get the job done in difficult circumstances. We will join The United Nations in preventing and resolving conflict; countering transnational security threats; ensuring food security for the world's neediest; improving health and education; addressing climate change; advancing international human rights; and a host of other issues. Having noted these challenges and the UN's potential for addressing them, we must acknowledge that at times our expectations have not always been met. We must continue to work with the secretary to improve accountability, transparency, oversight, and program effectiveness -- and the U.S. must fulfill its financial obligations while insisting on U.N. accountability.

If confirmed, I look forward to advancing U.S. interests before The United Nations and other international institutions in a manner that will help restore the position of the United States in world affairs and address the transnational challenges the president has made clear are among his highest priorities.

If confirmed, I will dedicate myself to this effort not only to address the immediate crises that will inevitably rise in the coming weeks and months but also to lay the groundwork for sustained U.S. leadership and multilateral engagement in the 21st Century -- thank you, madam chair.

SEN. BOXER: Thank you very much. Senator Wicker and I have decided each have seven minutes and I'm going to ask each of you a question. Richard, I have utter confidence in you as I do in the three of you. We have worked very closely together as the country got deeper and deeper into the Iraq war and you were always there with the facts and no preconceived notions and I think that's going to be very important for a secretary of state and for the president to have you here because you know that sometimes we just need answers. One thing I noticed with Secretary Rice -- well there were a few things I had problems with her on -- but one thing was that whenever I sent her a letter I didn't get an answer back from her. Now it could have been just me but I have a feeling it was the way she did business. She had the answer -- the answer came from the person who held your position and I am concerned about that because I think when a member of this committee or, frankly, a senator -- and I'll just speak for senators -- we really want to know -- we want to hear directly from the secretary.

So I don't know if you've given it any thought about would a letter that's just -- it's not just a -- if it's some kind of a non- important, non-substantial question I can understand it but if it's something of substance can we have your guarantee that she'd at least sign off on the answer and know?

MR. VERMA: Absolutely, Senator. Just to give you a sense of how much the Legislative Affairs office deals with on a given year -- and last year there were over 21,000 kind of congressional inquiries to the office and they were hopefully all responded to in a very timely basis -- but I think what you're talking about is a very high level inquiry from senator to the secretary and I can guarantee you that she will sign off on the content and the answer before it comes back to this committee.

SEN. BOXER: That would be very , very helpful. Melanne, I am so impressed with Vital Voices and I was so impressed with the strong support from Senator Hutchison and I was a little troubled by my dear friend's comments here because I don't want to see any trouble with your nomination. The women of the world need this position filled because I think Senator Wicker and I would agree on one thing, that when you improve the lives of women around the world the chances of getting more prosperity in the world, the chances of getting more stability in the world, the chances of getting peace in the world -- they go up exponentially. So I want to break through this now.

Everything I know about Vital Voices -- and you spent how many years there?

MS. VERVEER: Eight.

SEN. BOXER: Eight years. It says to me that you worked to empower women leaders who were working for political participation, economic advancement, and against human rights abuses like trafficking. I looked through the entire program to see if there was anything that had to do with abortion and your principles or what moved you. Can you just try to tell us about that so we can get that out?

MS. VERVEER: Yes, Senator, Vital Voices grew out of a federal government program that was a State Department initiative that was to help empower potential women leaders with the skills that they need to build democracies and economies in their country -- particularly in the nascent democracies. And the transference of the skills came from professional men and women around the United States who gave of themselves to help raise up the skills and abilities and capacities of women overseas.

From the very beginning of moving that program to an NGO, we were committed to a fully bipartisan approach and one that would be about what I just describe: the training of potential women leaders who are identified to have potential to make a difference in our world and who would get mentors and networks so that they could sustain themselves as they were driving change in their societies. And what kind of change are we talking about? Women in Kuwait getting the right to vote and stand for office; women throughout Africa trying to deal with the obstacles that prevent them from engaging in a level playing field economically; issues like inheritance rights and property rights; women in Northern Ireland who were at the peace table trying to bring an end to the sectarian conflict there and are now sharing their skills with women in Bosnia and in the Middle East -- that's the kind of work we did, senator.

SEN. BOXER: And this was bipartisan and this had the support of Secretary Rice?

MS. VERVEER: I worked very closely with the last administration on a variety of issues.

SEN. BOXER: Because I think there are certain things that shouldn't come down to fights and I don't want to see this turn into a fight over an issue that's not an issue. One of the reasons I'm so enthused about your nomination is not only that I know what a hard and devoted worker you are but throughout your career you've worked with women like Somaly Mam, who was a child in Cambodia who was sold as a sex slave by a man who posed as her grandfather. She was forced to work in a brothel where she was subjected to torture and abuse. As you well know, she escaped; she's dedicated her life to helping other women who are victims of sex slavery and human trafficking -- and these stories break your heart. And I know there's broad bipartisan agreement that this has to end.

According to the International labor Organization, women and girls account for 56 percent of victims in forced economic exploitation, including domestic servitude; 98 percent of victims in forced commercial sexual exploitations.

So I know this is a new position. You are going to be sort of the founding mother of this new position. How important will this issue be, human trafficking, to you as you take on this responsibility?

MS. VERVEER: Senator, it's a very, very important issue and I have devoted over the last decade to working on modern day slavery in terms of trying to combat it. When I served in The White House previously, it was because of hearing from the women, both overseas and in the United States, overseas telling us how women were disappearing; they had been lured into thinking they were getting great jobs only to disappear forever into a nightmare.

In the United States we were hearing how women were identified as victims. If they were fortunate enough to escape, they were sent back to their countries -- they were the problem, not the criminals who perpetrated the crimes against them. And it led to the Trafficking in Persons Act that was signed in 2000 and that has been in effect ever since -- several times reauthorized by the congress. That law continues to be a model for how we need to approach this problem. And you're absolutely right, in many ways it continues to be one of the worst violations of human rights afflicting our world, particularly women around the world.

The three pillars in that law: protection, prevention, and prosecution need to be worked through more holistically in a way where we don't just do an awareness program and forget the other two things or we don't deal with the root causes and give women alternatives to the dire economic situations in which they find themselves; that we work bilaterally with countries that aren't doing enough and help train their police and their judges and help them develop the kind of justice system that they need to have to function -- because it is governments, in the end, that have to bring these criminals and deal with them in a way that brings justice to these situations.

Beyond that, we've found that the NGOs who are closest to the ground know what's going on; they're dealing with the victims every day; they are often not listened to with respect to their governments. So we've got to work much more closely to encourage governments to deal with the civil society activists and their societies because together they can make a greater difference on these issues. I think we're also learning that the business community has a role. For example, in Cambodia Lexus Nexus is doing a great deal of work with Somaly Mam. Many kinds of exploitation are labor-involved and in those cases there is a responsibility on the part of the business community to deal with the exploitation of workers.

And beyond that, I think in terms of our own government this has got to be a high level bilateral priority in our relationships with other countries. I think we need to deal more effectively with the array of regional multilateral organizations throughout the U.N. system -- with the OSCE, APEC et cetera entities that can, indeed, address some of the critical questions that come out of dealing with this issue effectively.

SEN. BOXER: Thank you; my time's expired so we'll go here and I'll get back to you, Mr. Murray, with my next round.

Senator Wicker.

SEN. WICKER: Thank you Madame Chair. I'll begin with Mr. Verma. Thank you for your testimony and I particularly appreciate your emphasis on bipartisanship and I hope that we can promote in this subcommittee and you can promote in the department the notion of politics stopping at the water's edge.

You have a national security background in addition to your expertise in the area of foreign relations. Does it come as a surprise to you, Mr. Verma, that there has been criticism in the past over the quality of representation of the Legislative Affairs Bureau from the State Department? There, from time to time, has been an unfavorable comparison between the efforts of the Department of State and the Legislative Affairs Department and the Department of Defense. Do you believe that there are such differences and am I saying something that rings true to you and that you believe needs to be addressed?

MR. VERMA: Senator, I appreciate the question and actually know a fair amount about this subject. I spent most of November and December working on the defense department transition team -- specifically on the legislative functions -- and I think it's a hard comparison to make because the defense department has a legislative affairs function in every service; it has it on the Joint Staff; it has it on the combat and commands; it has it at the assistant secretary level; it has it at every sub-agency so the department can really swarm the Hill for many different places and have a lot of resources to do it.

I think the advantage of State is that it's much more centralized, coordinated, and my experience as a staffer was that it was a very nonpartisan place that was responsive. I think we can always do a better job and I think that would be what I try to bring to this job -- is that we be more responsive to you; that we do better in responding to the 3,000 questions for the record or the 21,000-plus pieces of correspondence we get but also educating members and staff about what the department is doing. They are doing some amazing things around the globe and I think if I could help facilitate this two-way flow of communication, not only from the congress to the department but also from the department to you, then hopefully we can improve the standing of legislative affairs in your eyes and of other members.

SEN. WICKER: Okay, well, I appreciate that answer. Let me segue back to the chair's question with regard to responding to correspondence because, madam chair, I'm not sure that I completely understood the answer.

As I understood the question, it was when a member of congress submits a letter addressed to the secretary, will that member receive a response signed by the Secretary of State? And I lost a little bit of the answer there because you mentioned the 21,000 letters that would amount to every year. Not withstanding the volume, what is your specific answer to Chairwoman Boxer's question in that regard?

MR. VERMA: I think there is a tradition of the assistant secretary responding. I don't think that as a rule -- I'm happy to look into it. I think what I was trying to say to Senator Boxer is that for member-level contacts to the secretary, the secretary would want to personally ensure that she signed off on the content.

And just from what I know about the process of getting a letter back to ensure that she had signed off on it and the content meets her standards and approval is very -- it's a very exacting process. I'm happy to take back which situations she actually responds to and which the assistant secretary responds to.

SEN. WICKER: Well, I understand it's hard for you to speak for her, and maybe that question hasn't been flatly put to the secretary. But if she's going to be involved in the signing off on the content I would wonder what policy considerations there might be in having the assistant secretary nonetheless be the signatory there. But I think I'll take that for the record, Madame Chair, but I think it's a very appropriate question for the chair to be asking on behalf of all members.

Do you anticipate at this point any specific legislative initiatives that the Obama administration will be presenting in short order?

MR. VERMA: I think, if confirmed, Senator, I would work very closely with the committee in presenting the legislative priorities of the department. Thus far, as you know, there's only the secretary and two deputies actually in place. Once we had a team in place we would be working with this committee to present those priorities to you.

SEN. WICKER: Thank you. Well let me then, if I might just move to Ms. Brimmer. Ms. Brimmer, President Obama during his nomination of Susan Rice as U.S. ambassador to the U.N. described the U.N. as an indispensable and imperfect forum. I want to ask you about the "imperfect." He highlighted the necessity of U.N. reform and I wonder if you are able to specify at this point what sort of reform the president might have been referring to?

MS. BRIMMER: Senator Wicker, indeed the U.N. is a crucial organization for the international security and for the national security of the United States. As the president has said, it is an imperfect vehicle but it is still a fundamentally important one. And so there are many interests the U.S. can advance at the United Nations. But it also needs to work on making sure that it's an effective and well-managed organization as well and will continue efforts to look at both improving the administrative work, the transparency and accountability of the institution. So if I were confirmed I would want to work diligently with our colleagues in the legislature and executive branch on ensuring that we continue to advance efforts to improve the actual management and working at the United Nations system.

SEN. WICKER: So in our view the president was referring to management issues and transparency issues that are areas in need of specific reforms?

MS. BRIMMER: Senator, while I'm not yet in the administration I've not had a chance to discuss in detail with the president. But as I look as an outsider into the system, those are some of the areas which I think the U.S. has been concerned with over the years.

SEN. WICKER: Okay.

Well, thank you, Madame Chairwoman.

SEN. BOXER: Senator, we'll come back to you.

Senator Webb, you have seven minutes.

SEN. JIM WEBB (D-VA): Thank you, Madame Chairman.

I wanted to come down and first of all express my support for the nominees and congratulate them on the opportunity to serve our country. I wanted to also express my appreciation for all the work that Richard has done here in the senate in the past; I know you were very helpful to us here in some pretty troubling issues when I first arrived here at the senate. I would like to raise one point, however. You mentioned that it's going to be your goal to improve the responsiveness of the office in which you are going to hold?

MR. VERMA: yes.

SEN. WEBB: I wanted to make a point that I have two phone calls in to you at this moment and I'm hoping to receive a call back before I vote on your nomination. (Laughter.) And I'd like to follow on something: I actually was following this hearing on the TV in my office as it progressed and I know that Senator Boxer talked about some of the difficulties that we had in the past with getting information out of the Department of State. These were serious differences. At one point two years ago I asked Ambassador Satterfield during a hearing to provide us with a list of the contracts that had been let in Iraq; I think at the time there were $32 billion worth of contracts that had been let toward the restoration processes and this sort of thing.

My question really was to try to develop an analytical matrix that would look at who would receive these contracts, what the amounts have been, what the specifications were, and what was the end result of these contracts in terms of performance? To this day I don't think I have been able to receive a satisfactory answer to that. I think that's a very important question in terms of sorting out the true facts of what happened and, as you know, Senator McCaskill and I put together a commission to examine wartime contracting. So, having spent five years in The Pentagon where this is data that I think we would have been able to put together pretty quickly, I think this serves as a good example of the type of frustration that people up here have so I hope we can do a little bit better on those sorts of things in the future.

MR. VERMA: Yes sir, absolutely. I totally agree that not sharing that kind of information probably presents unnecessary complications and I said in my opening statement that you can only do your jobs if you have accurate information and timely information -- and that would be my intent to try to facilitate that the best I can. And I'm sorry I didn't receive your two phone calls. (Laughs.)

SEN. WEBB: Well I'll be looking forward to getting a response in the very near future.

MR. VERMA: Thank you.

SEN. WEBB: Thank you, Madame Chairwoman.

SEN. BOXER: Now into our final round of questions, so I'm going to start with you, Ms. Brimmer. In the coming weeks I intend to hold a joint hearing of my new subcommittee, this subcommittee, with Senator Feingold's African Affairs Subcommittee to examine the simply unconscionable use of rape as a weapon of war and an instrument of genocide in conflict zones. In the hearing we intend to examine Darfur and the Democratic Republic of Congo as case studies. I realize many of you here today know what's been going on but let me just briefly go into it. In the Congo, militias have made rape their weapon of choice to terrorize women, girls, and entire communities. Thousands of women and children have been raped so brutally that they will never, very fully recover physically from their injuries.

Can you imagine these rapes are carried out specifically to mutilate women? According to the U.N., in one province in the Eastern Congo alone 6,766 rapes were reported in a one-year period between June 2007 to June 2008 with 43 percent of those cases involving children. Similar acts are being carried out in Darfur. A 2007 report by Refugees international found that "the raping of Darfuri women is not sporadic or random but is inexorably linked to the systematic destruction of their communities. Victims are taunted with racial slurs such as 'I'll give you a light-skinned baby to take this land from you.'"

Now how can we make the U.N. a more powerful tool for addressing these atrocities? What I love about this subcommittee and I'm so grateful to Senator Kerry for creating it for me, is that we not only will look at the status of women but we will have the oversight over the United Nations. And it seems to me, as you point out, the U.N. is so important here because it's the one place you can go to and you can look people in the eye there who know what's going on, on the ground. So, if confirmed, will you commit to me and to us that you'll make this issue a priority in your work with Ambassador Susan Rice?

MS. BRIMMER: Senator, thank you for your leadership on this issue. This is an extremely grave issue in international affairs and it's only recently that the international community has begun to understand the severity of these crimes. If I were confirmed, I would commit to working seriously on this issue and working closely with Ambassador Rice and, if she's confirmed, Ambassador Verveer on this topic. This is something very serious for the international community at large.

The United Nations could play an important role in addressing these issues particularly as it develops its peacekeeping operations; it's increasingly looking at making sure that experts who understand these issues are involved in helping planning these missions and looking at the impact of these crimes on violence in these areas. This is extremely important in terms of our work with the U.N. and I would commit to working on this issue.

SEN. BOXER: Well, that's really wonderful. And from the comments that I've had from my Republican friends, they seem very willing and ready to join hands with us on this. The thing that I think -- I know this happened -- is that when you decide you want to wipe out a tribe and you engage in ethnic cleansing, the way they have decided to do it is to destroy the family; and the way they destroy the family is to rape the mother in front of the children, to harm the children in front of the mother -- it destroys the unit and, therefore, destroys the larger community. This cannot stand and I think we have all been too quiet on this point. I put myself right in the center of that.

And even though we know how much work we have to do and how worried we are about the economy and we work from morning, noon, and night to get this economy back on track we still cannot close our eyes to these genocides and this ethnic cleansing and this violence. So I'm very pleased that you agree, both of you, about how important this is; thank you very much. And I'll give seven minutes to Senator Wicker and then you'll be happy to know you can rejoin your families and hopefully have a lovely evening. Senator?

SEN. WICKER: Thank you very much Madame Chair.

With regard to the chair's statement that she doesn't see the foreign policy in terms of abortion; certainly foreign policy is multifaceted but I do think, Ms. Verveer, that it's fair to say that in conjunction with the use of taxpayer dollars to pay for foreign assistance, a substantial number of Americans object to seeing those taxpayer dollars going to organizations that promote abortion as a means of family planning. So it is a matter of foreign policy and, in particular, a vast overwhelming majority of Americans object to the notion that somehow taxpayer dollars might go to fund organizations that promote as a matter of population control either forced sterilization or coerced abortion. That is the reason that the Kemp- Kasten language has been part of our foreign policy since the administration of Ronald Reagan as a matter of fact. Democrat and Republican administration alike have had such a policy and honored policy.

And also I need to respond, Madame Chair, I in no way suggested that the organization Vital Voices has any position, to my knowledge, with regard to pro-abortion positions. But it is fair to point out for the record that Ms. Verveer has been an officer, I believe, in People For the American Way -- is that correct, Ms. Verveer?

MS. VERVEER: That's correct, yes.

SEN. WICKER: What position did you hold there?

MS. VERVEER: I was the executive vice president about 20 years ago.

SEN. WICKER: And you have a perfect right as a citizen to make political donations but you donated to Emily's List on at least three occasions and so it's not Vital Voices that causes me to raise these questions -- it's the association with these organizations.

Are you familiar, Ms. Verveer, with the Kemp-Kasten language?

MS. VERVEER: I am, Senator.

SEN. WICKER: Okay. Well let me ask you -- and I may need more than seven minutes and it may be my Southern --

SEN. BOXER: You have seven minutes and then I'll have seven minutes and then you'll have seven minutes and then I'll have seven minutes and we could be here all night.

SEN. WICKER: Okay. I think the chairman was actually more accurate when she said you'll be out fairly early and we'll all have a good evening. But, be that as it may, under this appropriation bill this year purported to reenact Kemp-Kasten, it added a provision that concerned me and caused me, Madame Chair, to offer an amendment reinstating the old language.

What the language in the appropriation bill said was this: Kemp- Kasten is still the law but not withstanding any provision of law, funds shall be provided to the United Nations Population Fund. And so my question is this: in your view, how does that change American policy with regard to what our position is with regard to funding organizations that involve forced abortion and coerced sterilization?

MS. VERVEER: Thank you, Senator. Let me say at the outset as you well know, since you mentioned foreign assistance and the taxpayers of this country, that under the Foreign Assistance Act of 1961 as amended we are prohibited from funding abortions or abortion- related services -- that is not something that is done in the programming of the State Department and in our foreign assistance programs. With respect to UNFPA and Kemp-Kasten, there was a determination made that the prohibition under Kemp-Kasten of funds being used to support organizations that support coerced abortions and/or manage other programs that support coerced abortions is not allowable.

With respect to the decision made by the congress in the omnibus bill -- I'm not specifically familiar with the language you raised -- but a determination was made by the secretary of state and predicated on the facts as they were presented about the role of UNFPA that it does not meet the threshold; it does not fund or support organizations that are supportive of coerced abortions or manage programs dealing with coerced abortions. It turns out that UNFPA has a few programs in China and the record shows that they have done significant work in trying to get the Chinese to reduce abortions and eliminate this practice. None of the U.S. funds can go to China; can go for abortions; can go in a fund where other kinds of programs are being supported. This has to be in a separate account of the U.S. and UNFPA and it goes for services that really go at the heart of what women desperately need in so much of the world. Access to family planning -- there are millions and millions and millions of women who don't have access; access to maternal and child care in pregnancy and in childbirth; we've got a woman dying every minute that we sit here. These are the kinds of things that women desperately need.

And the United States puts a premium on reducing abortions -- a premium -- and efforts go to the heart through family planning of reducing abortions, not increasing abortions, not promoting abortion rights, not promoting new extended international rights in that realm but to reduce abortions.

SEN. BOXER: I'll take my seven and we'll go back to you for another. Seeing foreign policy through the lens of abortion is every senator's right and it's also every senator's right to point out that the best way to prevent abortion is to fund family planning and it shocks me -- shocks me -- that colleagues of mine -- by the way, a minority, very strong minority, who make this the centerpiece of everything they talk about do not support family planning and allowing funding to go to prevent the very thing they say they abhor. And we have shown that when families get family planning funds the number of abortions go way down. Now, for me it is shocking that we sit here in friendship with such a different lens.

I talk about children who are already born; they're already here; they're raped, being mutilated in front of their families. Those are the things we need to stop because, guess what, no U.S. taxpayer dollars can be used to fund abortions -- period, end of quote. And it's been that way for a long time. And if we're going to start questioning nominees -- oh, what candidates do you support and what money do you give to and who do you support? That's scary stuff -- because we're each entitled to our own opinion when we go into public service and we carry out the laws of the land. We have opinions; we carry out the laws of the land.

So my view is we come together today at a time when we're in two wars here; we've got rape being used as a tool of genocide, as a tool of war; we have ethnic cleansing going on; and a lot of the violence comes right at the feet of the children of this world.

I am very hopeful that despite some of the questioning of my friend that we could at least come together on helping the children who are here, number one, the children who are here. You know I had a friend of mine say many years ago that a lot of the anti-choice people said: we'd fight for your right to be born but after that you're on your own. I want to fight for the rights of every human being to make a decision regarding their own body however they come down on it -- whatever their religion tells them, whatever their morality tells them; I want to fight for that because, guess what, I don't feel I have the right to tell people how to think about moral religious issues. I believe it's up to them.

But I'm going to fight for these children who are here, and I'm going to fight for family planning funds so that we don't have to see a rise in the number of abortions -- and that's what I would hope we could find as common ground. But I think it is unfair to ask people what organizations they contribute to and pry into their personal views when they are coming on to work in government service where they'll still have their personal views but they're going to carry out the views of this administration. I never pried into the views of the Bush administration's people -- who they gave money too. I assumed that many of them were anti-choice and many of them gave money to organizations that I didn't agree with, believe me, I assumed so and it is their right and I defend it. I might not agree with them but I would just hope that we could come together as chairman and ranking here on the issues that will, at the end of the day, make this world a better place -- thank you.

SEN. WICKER: Thank you.

Well, before I get to my questions let me respond to my friend. I think it's unfair to suggest that I'm one of the people she described as all they talk about is abortion; but my opening statement, Madame Chairman, is one the record and I went on at length about rape used as an instrument of war; human trafficking; proliferation and then I mentioned abortion as one of those issues -- but certainly not all I talk about. It's perfectly all right apparently for the chairman to mention Vital Voices -- it's not prying into Vital Voices but the chairman mentioned with approval the witnesses good work with Vital Voices. I think it's also fair for the -- and I don't think the witness makes any secret of her active work for Emily's List or People For the American Way, it's just part of public record and I don't think the senator should be frightened about that.

But let me get back to my question because I'm really trying to understand -- and it may be, Ms. Verveer, that you have to answer on the record -- what change in your opinion or in the department's opinion, was made by this insertion of the language: not withstanding any provision of law funds shall be provided to UNFPA? Because in my view it says we're going to have Kemp-Kasten except we're going to fund UNFPA without regard to Kemp-Kasten. And so I would really be interested in your view on this issue and does the different language this year from the language in previous years actually have any force in effect of law?

MS. VERVEER: Senator, as I have said, I was not familiar with the language in the Omnibus legislation, however the decision to fund UNFPA under the existing language surrounding Kemp-Kasten was made on that basis, which was it doesn't meet the threshold. UNFPA's work does not contribute to the management of programs that endorse or engage in coercive abortions nor in supporting programs that include coercive abortions. So it's a non-issue issue in terms of the way that the decision was made based on the factual evidence of UNFPA's activities.

SEN. WICKER: Well, okay, I'm going to just differ with you there and would submit, if I might, for the record a letter dated June 26, 2008 with attachments signed by the Deputy Secretary of State John D. Negroponte with regard to the UNFPA providing support for the China country program, National Population and Family Planning Commission, and saying, therefore, that on behalf of the president he could not certify that American dollars would not be used for coercion. And so I would submit that for the record and we'll simply agree to disagree on our interpretations there.

You would and to the extent you can -- I know you're not a lawyer -- but I wonder if you could respond on the record as to what you see the difference being because it is an issue that we debated at length. I offered an amendment to return to the old language so if you could please, ma'am, submit to the record your interpretation once you've had a chance to think about it as to what the change actually means? Because I think it means something and maybe there are other people in this building and in this town who think that it didn't mean anything at all. So would you be willing to do that please ma'am?

MS. VERVEER: Senator, when I have a chance to read and study it if I might and get back to you with that. I have not seen the language and I'm not familiar with it.

SEN. WICKER: It is an issue that the State Department will be presiding over. So let me make sure that we're in agreement on a lot of things here. The chair said it is United States policy not to fund any overseas abortions at all. She and I agree on that much and I assume you would agree with that statement.

MS. VERVEER: Yes sir.

SEN. WICKER: And then in the debate on the Wicker amendment, which would have returned to the old Kemp-Kasten language, Senator Leahy said that current law already prohibits funds for abortion of any kind whether coercive or otherwise. Do you agree with that?

MS. VERVEER: Yes sir.

SEN. WICKER: And he also said that current law explicitly prohibits any funds being used in China by the United Nations Population Fund.

MS. VERVEER: That's correct.

SEN. WICKER: Okay, I thank you very much

And, Madame Chair, I very much appreciate your indulgence, if not your exasperation.

SEN. BOXER: That was a nice way to put it. Am pleased that you are saying how you feel and I want to say we did a little research while you were speaking -- this may help a little bit. Our understanding is that the exceptions against the ban on the UNFPA are for safe delivery kits, suture with surgery treatment, reducing maternal mortality, voluntary family planning, and no money to China -- is that correct? So that's our understanding but we will work together on this if it interests you.

So let me just say to all three of you, you're terrific; you're ready for these jobs you've been asked to perform. I want to speak on behalf of myself how honored I am that you've agreed to put yourself out there, take the abuse it takes when you decide to get into public service.

The record will remain open until the close of business tomorrow so in case anybody wants to ask any further questions, colleagues can do that -- and any documents that you might want to put in. And we intend to have these nominations considered during a business committee meeting next week. It is my hope as subcommittee chair to talk to Senator Kerry and I know he agrees that we really want to move these forward; so we hope that senators will cooperate and we look forward to your being in your positions as soon as possible.

And we stand adjourned.

END.

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