Hearing of the Defense Subcommittee of the Senate Appropriations Committee: Proposed Budget Estimates for FY 2009 for the Department of the Navy

Interview

Hearing of the Defense Subcommittee of the Senate Appropriations Committee: Proposed Budget Estimates for FY 2009 for the Department of the Navy

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SEN. PATTY MURRAY (D-WA): Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you to all of you for your service and for being here today.

Secretary Winter, I want to follow up on a little about what Senator Mikulski talked about. I think we're still playing catch-up as far as the poor planning that we went into after very long operations, now seven years in Afghanistan, almost five years in Iraq. And a large concern I have is the slow change of tide regarding the perception and attitude about psychological health.

And I wanted to ask, I know you talked a lot about the programs themselves, but what about -- what are we doing to really change the attitude all the way down at the bottom levels about sailors, Marines feeling comfortable talking about needing help with psychological issues?

SEC. WINTER: I think mainly the stigma issue, if you will, is I think a very critical issue; we recognize it. I think it's been recognized at all levels within both the Navy and the Marine Corps and has been attacked from the very senior levels all the way on down. The issue there I think is to, first of all, make clear what the leadership's position is on this, to make sure people understand the view, to provide mechanisms of facilitated access so that people can access medical care.

This has gone to the point of including forward-deployed mental health professionals as part of our OSCAR program, the operational stress combat -- I'm trying to remember the details of the acronym there -- a program which we are actually deploying mental health professionals with the forces to be able to provide close proximity and access.

We're also providing training for many people who have peripheral access to such issues, our chaplains and religious professionals who have the ability to guide individual service members to seek medical care when it is needed and appropriate. We're also trying to get Marines and sailors to help each other, and this has been a long- standing tradition. And I think some of the ways in which we are able to get that message out and have individual Marines recognize and be able to go Marine to Marine I think has a huge benefit.

Lastly, we're trying to work with the families. And one of the issues that keeps on coming up is how do you deal with this issue post-deployment and post-discharge. We try to do the normal checkups and all the reviews and things of that nature and we're looking to be able to re-evaluate --

SEN. MURRAY: It's oftentimes the spouse that recognizes PTSD or other --

SEC. WINTER: Exactly.

SEN. MURRAY: And I know you talked about some of the programs you have for spouses -- they're great -- but you need professionals who are helping the families understand what to look for, too. How are you dealing with that?

SEC. WINTER: And what we're trying to do there, ma'am, is to, first of all, help the spouses and families recognize the issues and then ensuring that they understand how to get help. And that includes a series of outreach activities as well as resources that they can draw upon by phone, by Internet and by visiting personnel, whether they're at fleet concentrations areas, major bases and operations, or out on the economy.

And so we're trying to facilitate that access so that they know where they can turn and understand the resources that are available to them.

SEN. MURRAY: General?

GEN. CONWAY: If I could augment a very complete answer just a little bit. I agree with you that we need professionals and we need programs, but we can also help ourselves and we are endeavoring to do that.

First of all, you get at why a Marine feels like there may be some stigma associated with it. And quite frankly, (sergeant?) major and I, when we go and visit and in publications are saying you don't get PTSD unless you're a warrior, you have had experiences that in some cases no one else has had, so you don't start out being weak or a wimp in this business of PTSD to begin with.

Secondly, some of our more senior people are experiencing it. We have a couple of sergeants major, our master gunnery sergeants out there, who are experiencing these kinds of things and it's just as true for them that we want to help you with this injury, because we consider it an injury just as certainly as an external wound; we want to help you with this and we want to get you through it because you can recover. We want to change the name from disorder to something else because it has, I think, a negative connotation with it.

And the last thing is, you're right, spouses sometimes recognize it even before the service member does and sometimes the dialogue says, well, don't report it or they'll toss you out. Well, we're not doing that. We want to get people through it and we want to keep them as productive members of our corps and --

SEN. MURRAY: And you're giving that message to people all the way down?

GEN. CONWAY: Absolutely, absolutely.

SEN. MURRAY: Admiral, what about the IAs in particular?

ADM. ROUGHEAD: We have a screening process for our IAs, and not just our active force. I think the greatest challenge we have are for IAs who are reservists who come back and then go back into their communities. So at the operational support centers, we're paying particular attention to that.

We also in the Navy have taken about 1,300 positions that involve medical providers, chaplains and other individuals, and have spent some additional time and resources on them to make sure that they too are familiar with the types of things that they must be aware of. And similarly with the Marine Corps, the effort to "de-stigmatize" the PTSD issue, and I do believe we're making some good progress in that regard.

SEN. MURRAY: Do we have enough resources to hire the mental health professionals that you need?

SEC. WINTER: I think, ma'am, we have the resources. The issue is in actually being able to hire.

SEN. MURRAY: To fill them?

SEC. WINTER: The availability of mental health professionals, particularly psychologists and psychiatrists, has been a challenge. We've done a little bit better with the mental health nurses.

We've done very well with social workers that we've been able to use in certain limited mental health capacities. But for psychologists and psychiatrists, this is a national challenge.

SEN. MURRAY: Okay.

GEN. CONWAY: Mr. Secretary, if I may?

Senator, that's why the provisions that you have provided us in the form of the incentives and the bonuses is so very important, particularly in the mental areas. So we thank you for that.

SEN. MURRAY: Well, I can assure you that a number of us on this committee really want to continue to work with you to get that message all the way down to the man or woman at the bottom but also to provide the services we need. And certainly I think we do have to worry about the capability of hiring enough professionals out there and want to continue to work with you on that.

SEC. WINTER: Greatly appreciate the support, ma'am.

SEN. MURRAY: Thank you.

To change the topic a little bit, I wanted to ask you about the military's ability to jam and use electronic warfare in Iraq and Afghanistan -- is certainly critical, as we all know, but historically, as we've seen, threats decrease, our electronic warfare capability is decreased and we have not invested in platforms and technologies and communities. Can you give me a current assessment of where we are on that?

SEC. WINTER: Right now, ma'am, our principal activity is the development of the Growler, which is the replacement for the EA-6B Prowler aircraft. The EA-6B is being used extensively in the theater right now. It is also the only mechanism we have of prosecuting electronic attack at this point in time. It is being used extensively and we're starting to get concerned about the life-limiting features associated with it.

Our analyses suggest that we -- a 84 aircraft Growler fleet is what we need to build to. We have requested funds for 22 Growlers in this budget, as part of that; that's in addition to five Growlers that are pending from the supplemental request in '08. We believe that that is a proper course towards providing satisfaction of the 84 aircraft requirement.

I will note that that sizing of 84 aircraft presumes that the Air Force would also participate in the development of additional electronic attack capabilities. We will --

SEN. MURRAY: Are you concerned that other agencies aren't investing?

SEC. WINTER: We will be looking at that, ma'am, as part of the 2010 POM evaluation and determining whether or not we're still comfortable with that assumption. And if that assumption is in need of "revisitation," we will take a look at the implications of that.

SEN. MURRAY: Thank you.

I also wanted to ask you, as you know, Naval Station Everett is one of the three West Coast locations under consideration as a homeport for the DDG-1000 that we talked about earlier. My understanding is that three of these ships will be stationed at a selected location, and with all respect to my chairman -- (laughs) -- I think Naval Station Everett obviously is an ideal location, but barring that, can you give us a quick assessment of where we are in the process and the criteria that will be used develop that?

Admiral?

ADM. ROUGHEAD: Senator, what we are doing is looking at what the lay-down of our force should be. When I came into this position a few months ago, I wanted to have a very thoughtful approach to where forces should be. My staff is working on that and I look forward to having that presented to me and then making the appropriate recommendations.

SEN. MURRAY: Okay, we look forward to hearing that very much.

And finally, Mr. Chairman, if I could, I just want to mention that the Navy is preparing a major overhaul of an existing maintenance pier at Naval Base Kitsap in Bremerton. I'm sure you're aware of it. It's a $150 million project and very important to all of us; there's no doubt that we all know how critical it is.

But I just was made aware of recently that there's several concerns that have been raised at the local level about the Navy's consultation with some of the impacted parties and I was hoping that you could just look at this later and make sure we're working with those local constituencies.

ADM. ROUGHEAD: Yes ma'am, we are and --

SEN. MURRAY: Are you aware of that?

ADM. ROUGHEAD: I'm aware of that. And the meetings that we've been having -- I'm committed to continuing to address the issues that have been put on the table. And as you pointed out, it is very critical that it get resolved because of the availabilities that will be coming into the shipyard and that we'll need that facility there.

SEN. MURRAY: Okay, thank you very much. I appreciate that.

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