Hearing of the House Armed Services Committee - U.S. Strategy and Operations in Afghanistan and the Way Ahead

Statement

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REP. JOE WILSON (R-SC): Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

General Barno, I want to extend greetings --

MR. BARNO: It's (an honor ?) for me to see you.

REP. WILSON: -- from your West Point classmate, State Senator Wes Hayes of Rock Hill. I want to thank you for your service at Fort Jackson, helping provide opportunity for young people to serve our country.

Also, as we discuss Afghanistan, my perspective, the 218th Brigade of the South Carolina Army National Guard is currently at Camp Phoenix and throughout the country training the Afghan army and police units. There are 1,600 troops. It's my former unit, led very ably by General Bob Livingston. At 1,600 troops, it's the largest deployment from our state since World War II, and so our state has developed a keen interest in success and victory in Afghanistan.

I also have the perspective -- I'm the co-chair of the Afghan Caucus. I have been to the country five times. The people are so impressive.

What I'm concerned about, General, is that having visited the police training facilities, having met the very brave people who volunteer to serve as police, what is the status of the police that you helped create? And I'm concerned about the pay, if it's a disincentive to corruption or an incentive for corruption.

MR. BARNO: I'm probably not fully up to the very most current information on police, but let me give you several thoughts, Congressman.

It's terrific to see you once again; I've spent a lot of my life in South Carolina and enjoyed my tour there immensely at Fort Jackson.

The police program I think is a success story that's still to happen in Afghanistan in many ways. We made a strong argument in 2004 and into 2005 during my time to shift the management of that over to the military and the embassy combined as opposed to having it managed by a very small element within State.

But I also think that there's misconceptions abounding on the police training programs in Afghanistan. Police in Afghanistan aren't the police we see on the corners in Washington. They're in a counterinsurgency war. They're the front line of defense in this war in many cases. They have to be armed with AK-47s and sometimes rocket launchers and machine guns because they're fighting the Taliban, not simply petty criminals on the street corner.

So I think that the training programs have got to account for that, and they've got to build a program for the police -- which I think is under way -- that gives them many of the same capabilities and many of the same mentorship opportunities that the Afghan national army has done so well with.

If the Afghans, whether police or military, are given, you know, the right training with the right weaponry and have Americans or our allies standing shoulder to shoulder with them as mentors, they will hold fast under difficult conditions.

And to the extent which we can import that idea into the police program, I think it will have prospects for success, perhaps even better than it does today.

REP. WILSON: And Ambassador Inderfurth, I had the privilege several weeks ago, sadly, of visiting with Prime Minister Bhutto at her home for breakfast. I also visited with President Musharraf.

I share your view that we need to be working with the Pakistani army. The military is professional. I was really disappointed to find out that, as you specifically identified, the night vision goggles -- that's no way to treat a partner.

Are there other suggestions that you can provide that we can work more closely with this army, which is truly facing the enemy today?

MR. INDERFURTH: Let me get to you on that. Let me talk to some people.

REP. WILSON: Right.

MR. INDERFURTH: I would like to give you a considered response to that, and I'm glad that you picked up on that.

This is terribly important.

This is a key to having a rising level of trust between the two militaries, yeah.

REP. WILSON: And they -- indeed, it's been cited they have 100,000 troops --

MR. INDERFURTH: That's right.

REP. WILSON: -- on the border with Afghanistan. They indeed are taking casualties. The insurgency has spread backward into the Swat region. This just needs to be addressed.

And again, I just appreciate all of you being here. And this country is -- the country of Afghanistan is so important to the security of our country. Thank you.

MR. INDERFURTH: Could I also mention that I spent time at Fort Jackson in basic training, which was a little bit different, perhaps, than some of the other experiences.

REP. WILSON: And I also want to commend you. I'm glad to see someone from Charlotte, which is greater Rock Hill, is doing well. Thank you.

MR. RUBIN: May I add?

REP. SKELTON: Please, yes.

MR. RUBIN: The Pakistan military does have professional characteristics as a military organization, but it also has some very unprofessional characteristics, such as staging coup d'etats and rigging elections.

And the fact that it has done those things is the reason that the people in Pakistan, generally speaking, do not share the regard that some of us have for the Pakistan military. And the key to our being partners with them is assuring that the military within Pakistan plays its professional role in a way that the citizens of Pakistan consider to be legitimate.

REP. WILSON: And one point on that. I did visit with the Pakistani military in Muzaffarabad in the earthquake recovery, and I was very impressed at their professionalism. But it does need to extend beyond coup d'etats.

Thank you.

MR. INDERFURTH: And the army chief of staff, General Kayani, has just issued an order that Pakistani military are not to have contacts with the politicians, which may be a step in the right direction.

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