Joint Hearing of the House Armed Services Committee and Hose Foreign Affairs Committee. The September Report: What's Next for Iraq?

JOINT HEARING OF THE HOUSE ARMED SERVICES COMMITTEE AND HOUSE FOREIGN AFFAIRS COMMITTEE
SUBJECT: THE SEPTEMBER REPORT: WHAT'S NEXT FOR IRAQ?

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REP. ADAM SMITH (D-WA): Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman and thank you for convening this very important hearing. And thank you to the two gentlemen for their service and for taking so much of their time today to talk with us.

I do have a couple of questions and I would urge some caution, General Batiste, in making in my opinion what are sweeping and damning statements with regards to the government of Iraq, saying that it's incapable of stepping up to its responsibilities. I would point out that coalition governments, even in mature democracies, struggle. Look at Italy. Ask the Israelis. Ask others. When governments fall, when members of the Cabinet resign -- it is almost the nature of a coalition government to have that kind of discordance. And when you say 60 percent of the people don't show up on the first day -- the members -- delegates -- members of their parliament -- you know, the question is why. Did they have trouble getting there? What was on the agenda? We have trouble getting our members back unless we have votes scheduled. I mean, there are some issues that should not be -- I mean, it needs more context, I think.

And also when you say that the GAO report the Maliki government is meeting only three of the 18 military and political goals, that's true. But you leave out that four are partially met according to the GAO, and some frankly -- and I would hope you would give some answers to this -- perhaps -- you know, at the time, we should wait and they should be layered. For example, I would wonder what you would think about amnesty. Twenty-five hundred people were let out in June -- or in 2006. But now the better side of prudence would dictate that an amnesty program should be part of a reconciliation program. So while technically that's an unmet benchmark, perhaps it should not be met. Look at the Northern Irish situation. Amnesty came after the reconciliation, after the Good Friday Agreement.

There needs to be, I think, a juxtaposition of when things should happen and delay is not denial. And yet the sweeping statement -- the big headline that only three out of 18 are being met has a great deal of surface appeal, but it's not very illuminating in terms of the situation on the ground. And again, you left out the four that are partially met and I would appreciate your thoughts on the amnesty. Should there be an amnesty now? If you say you're discouraged about only three of the 18 military and political being met, what -- do you want amnesty met right now? I would think the better side of prudence says we need to wait until some reconciliation goes forward.

And secondly, I was hoping that Governor -- or General Keane would answer this as well as you. But you know, we've had in the 20th century more genocides -- the very word was invented, as you know, after World War II. From the Armenians to the Germans to the Congo, Ukrainian and China, Bosnia -- I was in Srebrenica recently having worked on that issue very personally and profoundly while it was going on -- Rwanda, Cambodia, Darfur -- obviously an ongoing genocide. And yet people always say, "Where are the peacekeepers and the peacemakers?" Well, it seems to me in Iraq a real question that has to be asked -- if we leave prematurely and the situation significantly deteriorates, you said a moment ago that great things are happening on the ground. You questioned the sustainability of it, and I think that's a very, very good question. But great things right now are happening on the ground.

Absent the surge, absent the current military work that our men and women are doing so bravely, what happens if we leave prematurely -- before the Iraqis can step up to the plate? So if you can answer those two questions -- again, please in the future don't leave out the partially met and maybe give some context to things like amnesty, and I would appreciate your thoughts on amnesty since it's an unmet benchmark and yet you seem to think that's a negative.

GEN. BATISTE: Thank you.

Yeah, I mean, the benchmarks are what they are.

REP. SMITH: But as -- if you don't mind me interrupting and I would ask for your indulgence -- even yesterday Comptroller General Walker made it very clear, as I have -- and I've read the report. You've read it. Members have read it. It is flawed in many ways. It packages some things that really should be their own. And added to that, you've got the situation where some should be done later and not now. But on this report card, it reads as if "unmet -- bad." I don't want amnesty going forward right now, not when somebody could be let out who could do grave injury to our soldiers -- our men and women who are deployed there.

But I would appreciate your view and General Keane, especially on the -- General Keane -- on the whole issue of genocide. Is that a possibility going forward?

GEN. KEANE: Again, the benchmarks are what they are. I mean, that's the tool that we're using. For right or wrong, good, bad, or indifferent that's what they are. But the point is that the Maliki government is nowhere close to setting the conditions that our troops need so that we can get things reset, redeployed, and rearmed and refit our great military. Our army and Marine Corps largely -- to some extent the Navy and Air Force -- are held hostage by this government's inaction, and I did say that only 60 percent of the Iraqi parliament showed up on their first day after their break for a myriad of reasons, no doubt. A lot of it probably has to do with sectarian violence and they fear for their life and wouldn't make the trip to Baghdad to convene with the rest of the body.

What happens if we leave prematurely? Let's not leave prematurely. Let's get focused with a strategy that looks at the whole region as I've said over and over and recognizes that it's much more than the military. It's the diplomacy. It's the political reconciliation and the economic hard work that involves all the nations in the region to achieve what we're trying to do, and it also has to do with mobilizing this country to hold it all together.

Without all of those components, we're not going to get to where we're going and we're going to culminate the great military in the sands of Iraq, and that's not what you want to do and it's not what I want to do. But it's time for bodies like this to start asking questions -- great questions. Ask the Department of the Army, "How are you doing? What do you need to accomplish the mission that you have in Iraq and the other missions that you have around the world? Do you have what you need?" It's all about ends, ways, and means, and the current strategy we have now is flawed, big time.

REP. SMITH: I asked you directly if you could -- Benchmark Number 6, amnesty.

GEN. KEANE: Direct amnesty -- I would be loath to recommend to let everybody out of prison. I mean, there has to be a way to carefully look at that and vet each of those prisoners because you're not going to let loose those that are hardened and dangerous. So again, the benchmarks are what they are. I didn't write them -- you didn't write them. It's what we have.

REP. SMITH: But you referenced them without a context, with all due respect, that maybe some of those have a flaw that was not anticipated and now we're in a situation where hindsight may be a little more 20/20 than it was before, and that ought to come at the end of a reconciliation process it seems to me, and that ought to be covered because, again, I read the headlines in the paper -- three out of 18. You left out the four that are partial, and then some of those that really we should wait before those are agreed to.

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