Hardball - Transcript

HARDBALL

MATTHEWS: Welcome back to HARDBALL, live tonight, as I said, from Los Angeles. Arnold Schwarzenegger is the most prominent name among the Republicans in the recall race October 7, but he faces a challenge from the right. State Senator Tom McClintock is vowing to stay in the race even though Schwarzenegger supporters say he might siphon off the conservative vote and possibly cost Republicans the governor's seat. Tom McClintock, the Senator, joins is right now.

Senator, how do you see the race moving right now? Which direction are the numbers going?

STATE SENATOR TOM MCCLINTOCK (R-CA), GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE: Well, the momentum has been on my side. I began as an asterisks several weeks ago, and I'm in the double digits now. Meanwhile, in major polling, Arnold seems to be dead in the water at about the mid to low 20's. If that trends continues and particularly if Bill Simon's voters rally to my campaign, we may be in a dead heat with Arnold within the next couple of weeks.

MATTHEWS: When is the next poll you looking at? When is the next poll that is going to come out and tell you that you are in the high teens now?

MCCLINTOCK: I don't know. I suspect it will be coming out in the next week or two.

MATTHEWS: If you don't move to the high teens, if you get dead in the water, as you say as the Arnold Schwarzenegger campaign is, would you drop out of the race because you would become a spoiler at that point?

MCCLINTOCK: Well, no, first of all, I don't believe I'm a spoiler, Chris.

MATTHEWS: No, I mean, if you get about 10 or 12 points, you are by definition, a spoiler. If you go up into the teens ...

(CROSSTALK)

MCCLINTOCK: Well, you are assuming—well, you are assuming that my voters would migrate to Arnold Schwarzenegger. My suspicion is that a lot of the folks who are voting for me don't trust Arnold's fiscal policies and don't like his social policies. I would be very concerned about those voters staying home.

MATTHEWS: Well, wouldn't the vote—wouldn't they vote—well, wouldn't they be voting to get rid of Davis, at least?

MCCLINTOCK: Well, again, that's up to them, but you are assuming that ...

MATTHEWS: Can you imagine a real conservative ...

(CROSSTALK)

MCCLINTOCK: I think it's much more—I think it's much more likely that Schwarzenegger's voters would migrate to my column rather than vice versa.

MATTHEWS: Well, that sounds good to me. It makes sense to me, but let me ask you this. Do you think anyone would vote on October 7 to dump Gray Davis and wouldn't bother registering an opinion in the second question? Why would anybody do such a thing? It doesn't make any sense?

MCCLINTOCK: Well, historically you do see about a 15 percent drop off between the no votes that are cast on the first part of the ballot and then voting on the second question, on the succession question.

MATTHEWS: Historically. What is this—when is this type of ballot been available to the state before? When have you ever recalled a governor and had a chance to replace him?

MCCLINTOCK: No. The recall is a very common occurrence at the local level.

MATTHEWS: No. But what evidence do you have ...

MCCLINTOCK: True, this is the first state wide recall.

MATTHEWS: But, you have no precedence for this kind of election, do you?

MCCLINTOCK: Well, we do. We've had recalls all the time at a local level in California. It's a fairly common occurrence, and I'm told there's about a 15 percent drop off between the no votes on the first question and the succession votes on the second question. In fact, Dianne Feinstein has said that's precisely what she intends to do.

MATTHEWS: What's the biggest difference in policy between you and Schwarzenegger?

MCCLINTOCK: Well, I'm very concerned about the people that he has assembled around him. It includes the team that gave us the biggest tax increase in California's history, back in 1991, that broke the back of our economy. It includes, as his chief fiscal adviser, Warren Buffett, who is perhaps the most outspoken advocate of higher taxes in the country. That combined with his pointed refusal repeatedly take a no tax pledge leaves me very concerned about the policies he would pursue if in office. I am also seeing a lot of this ...

(CROSSTALK)

MATTHEWS: Schwarzenegger said he won't raise taxes—he said he won't raise taxes except in an emergency. What would you do in the case of an emergency?

MCCLINTOCK: Oh, that's why you have budget reserves. You don't want to compound one disaster with another, but, you know, a lot of this also involves trust. The positions that I have taken on issues have been unwavering and unchanging over 20 years in the public arena that I have been proposing the reforms to—to restore the state's economy and its finances and its public works. Meanwhile, Arnold Schwarzenegger came into the campaign pledging he would take no outside contributions, and now he has received over $1 million in contributions from corporate interests.

MATTHEWS: How --

(CROSSTALK)

MCCLINTOCK: Let me just finish this.

MATTHEWS: Sure.

MCCLINTOCK: In Sacramento on radio he fully acknowledged the "Oui" magazine article, and yet the very next morning in Fresno couldn't remember a thing about it. So, there's a credibility issue there that's becoming fairly significant.

MATTHEWS: You say you want to balance the budget. Why are you getting rid every the car tax? That won't help balance the budget, will it?

MCCLINTOCK: No, but it will help out taxpayers. That's a tax on a necessity of life. Not a penny of it goes near our roads, and it was illegal in ...

(CROSSTALK)

MATTHEWS: What's the big thing you'll do to—what's the big thing you'll do to balance the budget, Senator?

MCCLINTOCK: Well, simply restoring to the state government the same freedom every family has, to shop around for the best service at the lowest price, is about $9 billion in savings across all departments.

(CROSSTALK)

MATTHEWS: Can you name a program you'll cut? Can you name a program that you'll cut, Senator?Can you name a program that you will cut?

MCCLINTOCK: Well, yes, let me give you one example. We're the only state in the country that maintains two entirely separate tax agencies for the purpose of collecting taxes. They maintain duplicate offices in 16 cities across California. But, the first thing I'll do is rescind the car tax. I'll then act to void our electricity contracts and then I will call a special session of the legislature to replace California's Workers' Compensation laws with Arizona's. That will not only bring our Workers' Comp costs down by two thirds ...

(CROSSTALK)

MATTHEWS: I'm still waiting to meet a politician that won't cut a program. OK.

MCCLINTOCK: That's $2.5 billion in direct savings to state and local government right there.

MATTHEWS: OK. Thank you. Good work. Thank you, Senator Tom McClintock running for governor in the recall vote.