Hearing of the Senate Armed Services Committee

Federal News Service

July 29, 2003 Tuesday

HEADLINE: HEARING OF THE SENATE ARMED SERVICES COMMITTEE
 
SUBJECT: NOMINATIONS
 
CHAIRED BY: SENATOR JOHN WARNER (R-VA)
 
LOCATION: 222 RUSSELL SENATE OFFICE BUILDING, WASHINGTON, D.C.

SEN. JACK REED (D-RI): Well, thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. And welcome, General Schoomaker and General Brown. With all due respect, I really came to thank Sergeant McCoy (sp) and Captain Leahy (sp) for their service. Sergeant McCoy (sp) is a veteran of B Company, 2nd Battalion, 504th Infantry. And in 1976, I commanded that company. He is living proof that the paratroopers are better. They're taller. (Laughter.)

SEN. WARNER (?): Smarter?

SEN. REED: Smarter. And we're still very proud of them. So thank you, Sergeant McCoy (sp).

General Schoomaker, it's no secret that there was a certain degree of tension between General Shinseki and the secretary of Defense. And you're going into a position which you will require not only the confidence of the secretary of Defense, which I'm sure you'll have, but also the confidence of everyone within the Army, which I assume and expect you will get, too.

But there certainly is a different perception today about the relationship between the Army and civilian leaders of the Department of Defense. Can you comment on that and your perspectives going forward as to how do you see you're going to dispel any lingering rumors?

GEN. SCHOOMAKER: Well, sure. First of all, I can't speak to the specifics of what's gone on in the past that I wasn't witness to. But, like you, as a private citizen, I observed—you know, I know what the perceptions are and I saw the things that the media reported. And when I was asked to consider returning to active duty and take on this job, that was one of the things that was on my mind.

And since the secretary of Defense is the one that asked me to do this, that was one of the first things we discussed. And I'm convinced, through our discussions and our subsequent dealings, that we have an open and candid dialogue and that we have come to an arrangement where we can agree to disagree and at the same time understand what the chain of command is. And I'm very comfortable that he's going to hold to his word, and I know I'll hold to mine.

SEN. REED: Thank you, sir. I think that's an important point to begin your service.

One of the innovations that began several years ago was the Striker brigades. And they are poised now to begin their first operational deployment. Can you comment on that, and also additional changes that you anticipate—for example, less reliance on division headquarters as organizing elements and more on separate brigades?

GEN. SCHOOMAKER: Sure. The Striker brigade falls, in my view, in that area where I was talking about the intersection of the current force and the future force. And I think it's going to give us some tremendous insights into an Army with the capability to be much more strategically agile, where we can truly maneuver at operational distances.

And ironically, the Striker brigade that we're going to deploy—you know, I've looked at the organization—has more infantry in it than the heavy brigades that we're replacing, which, in an environment like we face in Iraq right now, is particularly useful. So there are some things there in terms of its strategic agility, in terms of its tactical mobility, in terms of its relevance in terms of the kinds of things we're facing today, that I think the Striker brigade is going to be -- (inaudible).

But the most important thing—there are two things that are really important to me, and General Brown touched on one of them. You know, the Army is people. And our ability to retain and train and to advance these tremendous people that we have, these soldiers, not only train them for certainty but educate them for uncertainty and to create, you know, a human element that are problem-solvers. The kinds of problems that you see them solving every day on the streets of Baghdad and elsewhere is fundamentally important.

The second thing that's important is that we leverage technologies that allow us to network and operate in a network-centric environment. The reason an ODA, a Special Forces A-team, can kill more tanks sometimes than what you will find perhaps in an Apache deep attack or something, is the fact that they have a radio that is (jointly netted?) that allows them to call on the entire Department of Defense. They don't care where the effects come from in destroying these targets. All they care about is that they arrive on time and with the precision that's required to do it.

And so it goes back to the question I was talking about a while back. You know, this isn't all about how many people you put on the battlefield. It depends upon what capabilities you put on there and their ability to move about and be relevant at the time and place of your choosing to do the kinds of things that we need to do, not only in battle but in winning the peace.

And so these are the kind of things, I think conceptually, that we have to get our head around and make sure that we resource properly, because it isn't just an issue of wheels versus tracks, platforms—you know, what kind of a cannon, what kind of an APC and a tank that we have. It's got a lot to do with how we bring the whole team into the fight in a very agile way in a strategic basis.

So I'm sorry to go a little long on that, but it's a very comprehensive issue. And this is the way we're going to approach this if I am the chief.

SEN. REED: Let me ask one additional question, General Schoomaker, before I ask General Brown a question. And that is, we have all noticed that, particularly in Iraq, we're suffering casualties when Humvees are engaged, either by RPGs or by grenades. Is that causing you to relook at the type of equipment we have and mobility equipment we have in Iraq to give our soldiers more protection?

GEN. SCHOOMAKER: Absolutely. But I will tell you that the physics of the point are that the tactics and your procedures have a lot to do with all this. I mean, we could put tanks in position and they could be vulnerable as well. And so, you know, you and I had the conversation about the up-armored Humvees. And this is a matter of programming and affordability and the whole issue of management and how to get those. And soldiers deserve that. We should give them the very best that we can give them.

But, nevertheless, they have to also be used in a manner that's commensurate with the environment in which they're in. You know, I played football in college, and, you know, that doesn't get you much more than a cup of coffee sometime, but I played for a very successful team. I played for a guy by the name of Fritz Shurmur, who took the Green Bay Packers—you know, he was the big NFL defensive guy. And he taught us that there's more ways to win on defense than there are on offense. You can score more ways on defense than you can score on offense.

And part of this whole deal is the offensive mindset, even in a defensive posture, and how your tactics, techniques and procedures operate so that you don't place yourselves in a position—you keep the enemy, your opponent, off-guard and do things. And so, again, I'm going long, but I don't think there are just pure technological solutions to all these problems. I think this is a thinking man's game. It's one that has to change all the time. It's a leadership business.

And while I'm committed to making sure that we design and develop and train the very best forces we can, we also have to be hand-in- glove with the joint force commanders to make sure that our doctrine and the rest of it evolves, you know, to maximize the potential of what we feel.

SEN. REED: Thank you, sir. My time expired. General Brown, we had a chance to chat yesterday.

GEN. BROWN: Yes, sir.

SEN. REED: And I have every confidence that you're going to do an extraordinary job, as well as General Schoomaker, to lead the Army.

GEN. BROWN: Thank you, sir.

SEN. REED: Thank you very much.