Senate Commerce, Science and Transportation Subcommittee on Consumer Affairs and Product Safety Holds Hearing on Transportation and Border Security
FDCH TRANSCRIPTS
Congressional Hearings
Apr. 9, 2003
Senate Commerce, Science and Transportation Subcommittee on Consumer Affairs and Product Safety Holds Hearing on Transportation and Border Security
WYDEN:
Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I too want to welcome an old friend, Tom Ridge, and have a number of areas I want to talk with him about but want to mention one in specific that I hope my colleague will talk about in his opening statement and that is this question of privacy.
The American people clearly want their government to fight terrorism ferociously and at the same time to do it in a way that doesn't gut our civil liberties, our basic freedoms, and I'm very concerned when you look at some of the programs that have been rolled out recently, the Total Information Awareness Program, the CAPS II Program with respect to airline screening that our government isn't striking the right balance.
And, for example, in the homeland security legislation it calls for the establishment of a privacy officer. I'm not clear as to whether even that person has been named at this point and perhaps you can enlighten us on it. But what concerns me is I want to make sure that privacy issues are dealt with up front, that they don't just become an afterthought and basically after all the policies are made then somebody says well, holy Toledo, we ought to think about civil liberties questions at some point before we roll everything out.
If you could address your approach with respect to privacy. There will be other issues that I want to ask you about, particularly some of the reports of waste and mismanagement and I'll get into that in questions, but I'm particularly concerned about how we're going to strike a balance between pulling out all the stops to fight terrorism and protecting our citizens, while at the same time being sensitive to these questions of privacy. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
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WYDEN:
Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and Mr. Secretary you've got your hands full, an enormous amount on your plate, and having worked with you for a lot of years, I know how you tackle these issues in a professional way and I appreciate it.
My concern about the CAPS II Program is really highlighted even by what we've talked about this morning. The CAPS II Program is arguably one of the biggest background checks this country has ever had. I mean every time you get on a plane you're going to go into this color-coded system, green, yellow, and red.
And, as far as I can tell the major decisions are now being made on CAPS II without a privacy officer being on deck and that, in effect reflects my concern is what I've always wanted is to make sure that these privacy issues are dealt with up front, that the privacy officer is at the table, you know, making the case for how we're going to fight terrorism aggressively and at the same time be sensitive to civil liberties and yet these decisions are being made now without the privacy officer being in place.
When do you think such a person, you touched on it in your opening statement, when do you think such a person would be on deck as the law (inaudible).
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WYDEN:
Now, what was published in the Federal Register with respect to the program originally that was done back in January I think it's fair to say does not resemble what you have described on page 4 in your testimony. For example, you talk on page 4 about how data would be purged from the computers immediately after the passenger's flight ended.
RIDGE:
Right.
WYDEN:
And the notice back in January said, for example, that some of the data could be kept for 50 years, which certainly, you know, struck people as a bit far-fetched. When do you think there would be a new notice in the Federal Register so that the public could weigh in again on any other proposed revisions?
For example, I want to seeagain in your statement you talk about TSA will rarely see the background information checked by the computer. One of the things that's concerned me is what happens if the information is inaccurate because there's certainly been a lot of inaccurate information in private sector databases and we have seen problems stemming from that. So, my question here is when would there likely be a new Federal Register notice on CAPS II so that the public could have another shot to comment?
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WYDEN:
Let me see if I can get one other question in, but know that I'm anxious to work with you on this. As you know, with the support of Chairman McCain and Hollings, I was able to add legislation.
FITZGERALD:
The secretary has to leave in about a half hour, so let's make it quick.
WYDEN:
As another question?
FITZGERALD:
Yes.
WYDEN:
All right, one other question with respect to waste and inefficiency. This week, the "Los Angeles Times" published a very disturbing story about possibly $250 million worth of waste at the TSA and my concern is that given the fact that we've got this on the record with respect to TSA, your department is conducting essentially on very much the same sort of challenge, how to deal with tackling these issues in a very quick way with relatively few kind of precedents to deal with. How are you going to prevent at your agency similar kinds of problems that they saw at TSA involving hundreds of millions of dollars?