MSNBC "The Beat with Ari Melber" - Transcript: Interview with Rep. Zoe Lofgren

Interview

BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT

MELBER: Breaking news tonight.

We are just getting exactly this moment in our newsroom a list of new subpoenas that are coming out from this January 6 committee. If you watch the news, you may notice that, as of a few moments ago, we said this is the kind of thing we have been waiting on, but we literally just got them.

And we think we have quite a notable guest for it, Congresswoman Zoe Lofgren, an experienced investigator and a Democrat from California who serves on the January 6 committee.

[18:25:02]

Thanks for being here.

You know more than most about this plan, the timeline and what we just got, which is a list of some of the subpoena targets. What can you tell us about this?

REP. ZOE LOFGREN (D-CA): Well, this is an active investigation, as is obvious.

The subpoenas that were just issued are really directed at the organizers of the rally, people who helped fund it, people who sought the permits. They were campaign people. And we need to understand what was afoot here. From the very beginning, we have needed to find out who funded it, who planned it.

There was a mob that said they wanted to kill Vice President Pence, wanted to kill the speaker, wanted to overturn the election. We need to find out everything about how that happened. And this is a step to do that.

MELBER: Yes.

And, Congresswoman, I`m just doing this live with you, because, if I had gotten this list hours ago, I would have done my homework then. So permit me to just be a journalist. But I see here just in the documentation that we got, it says that you`re -- the committee is investigating Women For America First and trying to get more information about what their -- what I take to be their motives or intentions.

You have got 11 individuals, including their founder and chair, Amy Kremer, Cindy Chafian, which is listed here as the person who submitted the first permit application to get that January 6 rally going, some names that news viewers might recognize, like Katrina Pierson, who worked directly on the Trump campaign.

It states here she was involved the organization of this January 6 rally and in direct communication with the former president about the rallies. That`s quite striking.

What do you hope to learn from these individuals and the records you`re seeking about what happened leading up to the rally?

LOFGREN: Well, we don`t want to jump to a conclusion. We`re doing an investigation, not an accusation.

We want to find out everything there is to know about the coordination between the White House and these individuals whose names were up front in organizing the rally, what the intentions were, where did the money come from, how was it organized, how was that mob unleashed on the U.S. Capitol to overturn the election?

We think that we will learn things from these individuals. And what we have found is that we`re -- as we get more information, it leads us to other information. Quite a few individuals have come forward voluntarily to provide information. Some people are asking for subpoenas.

So there will be more of those in days and weeks ahead. Others may be more recalcitrant, but whatever it takes. Our job is to get to the bottom of this. And we take that task very seriously.

MELBER: Though there was, of course, a second impeachment about some of these underlying issues.

The president, through the constitutional process, was not convicted in that, although there was then some troubling evidence, but much more seems to be publicly known now. And, as you explained, you`re investigating all these leads.

This reference to direct communication between Ms. Pierson and Donald Trump, is one of the investigative leads or theories of the case that this committee is going to explore is whether or not Donald Trump knew or was discussing the prospect of using breaching the Capitol or violence as a plan, as part of the goal of January 6 in advance?

LOFGREN: I will just say that a majority of the House, including Republicans, and 57 percent of the United States Senate found that the president, then-president, incited this riot. That was the vote.

Now, we didn`t have available to us all the information that is now coming forward. We need to find out every detail about this. And when we have all of the facts, we`re going to be able to lay that out for the American people in a way that we think will be helpful for our country.

We need to save our democracy here. We need to make sure that the threats to our democracy are averted, and that our wonderful American experiment in self-governance is preserved.

MELBER: And in our introduction to you, again, before we just got this breaking news -- and for those joining us, it`s brand-new, 11 subpoenas of new individuals, including at least one former Trump campaign official from the January 6 committee.

In our introduction to you, Congresswoman, we also mentioned the fact that the president, the former president, has publicly asked people to resist and not cooperate with your committee.

Just for the record, what is your response to that request? And what should those individuals and these 11 individuals know about any obligations they have legally?

LOFGREN: They have an obligation, each of them, to respond to the subpoena and to produce documents and testimony as they have been directed to do.

[18:30:09]

The president, the former president, is a very litigious person. We all know that. He likes to sue people a lot. He usually loses. He`s not the president. He doesn`t have executive privilege because he`s not the president. And so we`re prepared for whatever litigation.

But I think some of this is frivolous. These individuals were not employees of -- they were not White House counsel. And even then, we got the White House counsel. The court ordered him to testify before the House Judiciary Committee.

So I don`t think the former president is on firm ground, but we`re ready to proceed to do what we need to do to get the facts. And I would hope that the president not involve himself in obstruction of Congress, because that itself is a violation of the criminal code.

MELBER: Referring to the McGahn case, which, of course, the House did when, as you say. There was an effort by the then-Trump administration to fight it. They lost. McGahn, the White House counsel, did testify.

You said, Congresswoman, you don`t think Donald Trump`s on firm legal ground there. I would say that`s quite diplomatic. It really looked like he was on quicksand.

LOFGREN: Right.

MELBER: Because he filed a lot of suits that resulted in the loss.

That brings me the final question. Again, I appreciate you Being here on a busy day. My final question is, with this executive privilege battle -- we talked a lot about the Trump side -- what about the Biden White House, which, as we reported, initially said from the lectern no privilege for you, Donald Trump?

Then they came back and said, well, it`s case by case. But with regard to your committee, it`s one case. It`s the January 6 case.

LOFGREN: Right.

MELBER: Do you have an understanding of what the Biden White House`s position is? Will they honor Donald Trump`s attempt at secrecy here or overrule it, reject it, and provide this information? Do you know yet?

LOFGREN: Well, what I take from the Biden administration is, they don`t intend to stonewall the Congress or the select committee on this.

Having said that, it is appropriate to take every assertion and evaluate it, and -- on the facts and the law and reach a conclusion. But very clearly, they`re not intending to participate in a cover-up of this, which is apparently what the former president is seeking to do.

I think he does not look like an innocent man when he tries to prevent the truth from coming out.

MELBER: Understood.

Congresswoman Lofgren, thank you so much, again, on this breaking news, 11 people named in these new subpoenas. Appreciate your time.

Source