MSNBC "The Beat with Ari Melber" - Transcript: Interview with Gregory Meeks
Interview
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Congressman Gregory Meeks is the powerful chairman of the House foreign affairs committee, having dealt with these issues for many years, things the president referred to, including the long-running clashes over how to get in and out of this conflict. And "The New Yorker"`s Robin Wright, an acclaimed author, an award-winning journalist. Her latest article, "Does the Great Retreat From Afghanistan Mark the End of the American Era?"
Mr. Chairman, I begin with you.
The president spoke very clearly to the nation. He did not really give an inch on the fact that he says that, while terrible, gruesome and tragic, these scenes that we`re seeing, he says, if anything, the last week ultimately reinforces why the United States should no longer be spending blood and treasure there.
Your reaction to the address today?
REP. GREGORY MEEKS (D-NY): I think the president was absolutely correct.
Look, we spent close to a trillion dollars, trained over 300,000 people to be a security force, allegedly, so that they could fight on their own. And they just laid down. So, why -- I don`t see how the American people can continue with a surge, because that`s the only other thing that could be done is to surge to go back up to 10,000, 15,000, 20,000, 25,000 people, and be basically the security force for the Afghan people that aren`t fighting for themselves.
So it is time, after 20 years. But, remember, we went in to get Osama bin Laden and to make sure that the terrorists there would no longer organize the threat against us.
Now, we -- to fight against us. We were successful. We could have left that. But we thought that it would be good to try to make sure that we could change the tide for women and girls particularly. So we stayed there another 18 years, did all that we could. And if they don`t have the will to fight, because we can`t make them have the will to fight -- a lot of this time, they have moved so quickly without a shot being fired some places.
MELBER: Yes.
MEEKS: Nothing...
(CROSSTALK)
MELBER: To that point, sir, let`s play a little more from the president. He gave this address.
And Americans have lived through this. How many different presidents have we seen giving different addresses about this region? And building on the point you were just raising, he talked about how the deterioration and how quick it was is part of the security situation there. It was fast in part because it wasn`t much of a fight at this point, once the United States wasn`t on the ground.
Take a listen.
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BIDEN: The truth is, this did unfold more quickly than we had anticipated.
[18:05:01]
So what`s happened? Afghanistan political leaders gave up and fled the country. The Afghan military collapsed, sometimes without trying to fight.
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MELBER: Mr. Chairman, why is that important -- some of that is documented and true -- our own reporters have been on that as well -- for Americans to understand?
Because the flip side is looking at images in a place that we as a country were, and people understandably feeling bad, wondering, is there anything more to be done?
MEEKS: Because, at some point, you got to fight for your country.
It can`t be someone from outside of your country fighting for your country. They want more for you than you want for yourself. At some point, you have got to say, enough is enough.
And I think we were at that point. I was at a meeting with President Ghani when he was in the United States. And the question was asked then, will they fight? And he said that they would.
But yet he was the first one to leave town without a shot being fired or anyone defending them.
MELBER: Yes.
MEEKS: He said he had to have a government that people could believe in. MELBER: Right, right. And he...
MEEKS: The images that I see are shocking and horrible, and it breaks my heart, as well as all of the men and women who -- especially the brave Americans, and Afghanis who stood by our side and put their lives on the line.
So now, it`s time for us to focus. And we do have to keep our commitment to them and get them out of there. And that`s what I hope we are focused on right now, to make sure that every single one of them gets out of there and into someplace safe.
But I tell you, as a member of the United States Congress and chair of this House Foreign Affairs Committee, I cannot advocate surging. I cannot advocate kicking it down the road for another five, 10 years.
MELBER: Right.
MEEKS: Because I don`t think that will make a difference either.
MELBER: Right.
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