MSNBC "All in with Chris Hayes" - Transcript: "Trump refers to critics as "human scum.""

Interview

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VELSHI: So what the Democrats are doing right now according to Trey Gowdy will produce better results. And in a few weeks according to the Washington Post, Democrats are planning public hearings and hope to have Bill Taylor, former Ukraine Ambassador Marie Yovanovitch and even John Bolton tell the world exactly what they saw. I`m joined now by Democratic Congressman Jimmy Gomez of California. He is a member of the House Oversight Committee who has been participating in the impeachment hearings. Congressman, good to see you.

REP. JIMMY GOMEZ (D-CA): Good to see you.

VELSHI: If you didn`t know what was going on and you were just getting your input from the White House or Fox News, the impression you would have is that you Democrats alone are holding secret hearings in which there are no Republicans.

GOMEZ: Yes, correct. But if we`re only getting our information from Fox News then the White House would believe the world is flat which we all know that that is not true, right? So what we`re doing is actually following the rules that were established by Republicans in 2015, and we`re following them by the book. And what you saw yesterday by Matt Gaetz and the Republicans was just a despicable display of political theater that is undermining our national security by taking in electronic devices into a secured facility. That actually hurts not only just Democrats but it hurts our national interests.

VELSHI: But there is a narrative developing that there`s something secret going on there. In that room that you have been in, are there Republicans?

GOMEZ: There`s a lot of Republicans. It`s wall to wall. There`s so many -- remember, we have representatives from three committees. We have Oversight, Intel, and Foreign Affairs, and the room is packed. You have people standing along the wall that are members from both parties listening very intently to the witnesses.

VELSHI: All right, so what happens now? Is this reporting that we`ve got that these will become public hearings at some point? Is that what you believe to be true?

GOMEZ: No, I haven`t been told that specifically, but I always said you got to let the product determine the process, right, and the pace of the process. So if we had interviews with everybody we have interviews with, make sure that we ask all the questions in an appropriate setting and it determines that we need to move to the next phase, then we should move to the next phase. But it`s not about politics, it has to be about discovering the truth. And that`s what we`re doing.

VELSHI: All right, so what`s the difference? What happens behind closed doors versus what we are likely to see when something becomes public?

GOMEZ: Well, one of the things that you see behind closed doors -- this is my time ever participating, it`s actually you get an hour to ask questions. And it is not like the back-and-forth that you see in a -- in a regular hearing. No Democrat or Republican is trying to get the next viral moment, you know, try to get more Twitter followers or kiss up to the president. It is very specific on trying to get information. And that is actually produces I think better results. I`m going to agree with Trey Gowdy, I don`t do that often, but it does produce more information, it`s not just for grandstanding purposes. So that`s -- it`s a very, very, very different process than you see on the outside.

VELSHI: The impression that Republicans are trying to create is that if you open these hearings up right now, if you let everybody in, if you let cameras in, if you let everybody see what was going on, it would somehow exonerate the President or be good for the president. And I know you can`t tell me about the testimony you`re hearing, otherwise, you`d have to kill me, but how would you characterize that impression that this would be beneficial to the president somehow?

GOMEZ: You just can`t change the facts. The facts are very clearly on that first call that everybody has read that the transcript that was released by the White House that he asked a foreign government to interfere and investigate a political rival in a U.S. election. That by itself is abuse of power. That by itself is abuse of power.

VELSHI: Donald Trump has been complaining. I want to show you an article from The Daily Beast on Tuesday night. Trump whines the Senate Republicans are failing him on impeachment and not owning nearly enough libs. The President and the White House have put a message out there to Republicans, you`re not defending me enough. And so yesterday you saw what you saw in the House. Today, you saw Lindsey Graham out there with his presentation. The message seems to be stick up for me and the argument that Republicans seem to be able to come back with is a process argument as opposed to a substance argument.

GOMEZ: Yes, because when you can`t argue the facts, then you have to turn to the process. That`s what you always, always see. So it shows that they`re desperate and it shows right after the Taylor interview how bad that his testimony actually was. For me, it really collect -- connected a lot of the dots from people, to motives, to actions. So people have to pay attention to Taylor. He`s very key.

VELSHI: Congressman, good to see you. Thank you for being with us.

GOMEZ: Good to see you.

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