CNN "Anderson Cooper 360" - Transcript: Interview with Rep. Mary Gay Scanlon and Rep. Joaquin Castro
Interview
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COOPER: Yes. Kaitlan Collins, thanks very much.
Joining us now, two lawmakers who will be questioning Mr. Mueller tomorrow, Pennsylvania Democratic Congresswoman Mary Gay Scanlon, vice chair of the House Judiciary Committee. Also, Texas Democrat Joaquin Castro who serves on the Intelligence Committee.
Congresswoman Scanlon, thanks for being with us.
First of all, I don't quite understand the -- I mean, the president's upset about this. Clearly, it seems he's just looking for any reason to kind of again say this is a rigged witch hunt. But what's the big deal about Robert Mueller having somebody who he consults with. People have attorneys all the time, people they consult with during their testimony.
REP. MARY GAY SCANLON (D-PA): Well, it disrupts what the White House
has been trying to do with respect to the Mueller report. They redacted the report. They've tried to keep witnesses from appearing and testifying and they've suppressed the evidence. So, any additional help in telling the story, I think that goes against what they are trying to do.
COOPER: Why do you think Mueller waited until the last minute to do this? Does that raise any concerns for you?
SCANLON: I don't think so. I mean, I think there's been ongoing conversations about whether or not he would bring one or more aides with him. So, you know, as we've mentioned, it's an extensive report. A lot of witnesses were interviewed. A lot of documentation was gone through.
So, he probably just wants to make sure he's as complete and thorough as possible.
COOPER: Congressman Castro, Adam Schiff indicated the same request has been made of the Intelligence Committee. Has that request been granted and would the rules be around his deputy appearing to be the same as they are for the other committee?
REP. JOAQUIN CASTRO (D-TX): Yes, that's still being worked out and I take it to mean that Robert Mueller, because he's going to be talking about a report that is a few hundred pages probably wants somebody there to help him get into the nuances if he gets asked and he will get asked some questions that are very detailed. You want somebody there who knows the report back and forth also that can help you.
[20:10:04] COOPER: Congresswoman Scanlon, I understand the Democrats on the Judiciary Committee held essentially a mock hearing today which is, you know, something a lot of people do before debates and any big thing like this. Is there anything you can say about what you learned in it in taking part? Because I understand you actually even had somebody, you know, playing the roles of Republicans, Jim Jordan who obviously, you know, will probably be very vocal tomorrow.
SCANLON: I think the focus was really on making sure that we were as efficient as possible. We only have Mr. Mueller there for a limited amount of time and we want to make sure we cover --
COOPER: Is two hours for your committee or three?
SCANLON: No, it's three.
COOPER: Three?
SCANLON: Yes.
COOPER: So, how much time do you have -- does each member have for questioning?
SCANLON: The committee works under the five-minute rule.
COOPER: OK.
SCANLON: So, that's about what it is.
COOPER: So, let me just ask you, are you members of Congress, you know, sometimes they get criticized for making lengthy statements and kind of, you know, enjoying their time in the spotlight.
SCANLON: Grandstanding?
COOPER: Grandstanding, yes.
SCANLON: That's the term you're looking for, yes.
COOPER: Is there going to be a lot of that tomorrow? Because, I mean, that eats up a lot of time.
SCANLON: I don't think so. I think everybody is aware of just how serious this hearing is going to be and they're going to comport themselves accordingly.
COOPER: Congressman Castro, I want to play what Chairman Schiff had to say today about Mueller's testimony and then ask you about it.
CASTRO: Sure.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. ADAM SCHIFF (D-CA): People are pretty dug in on not just Trump and Russia but they're just dug in on this president, if that appalling display of racism over the last two weeks wasn't enough to move people, is there anything that Bob Mueller can say that will?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Congressman Castro, do you think he's right? I mean, do you think there is anything that Mueller could say that would actually move people's opinion about the president one way or another?
CASTRO: I hope so because Bob Mueller is going to be talking about things that are fundamental to our democracy, about potential obstruction of justice by the president of the United States, issues of conspiring with members of a foreign government to interfere with our elections, and then finally, perhaps issues of money laundering and leverage that a foreign government may have over the president or people that are in his circle.
So, hopefully, the American people with as much as possible will listen with open ears.
COOPER: Congressman, though, I mean, you say hopefully and I certainly understand your position on this, but -- I mean, all the information it seems that Mueller is going to give tomorrow are going to be asked about, he's going to stick to what is in the report and I know a lot of people have not read the report, most people have not read the report in the country.
CASTRO: Right.
COOPER: But essentially, people, you know, if they had any modicum of interest have a general sense of what is in the report and it doesn't seem like Mueller is, you know, given, we've looked at, you know, hundreds of hours of prior testimony he's given over the years, he has certainly not, you know, an emotional, demonstrative witness.
CASTRO: Yes, no, I think that's true. Look, there will be a crowd of people who have already made up their mind and it really doesn't matter what you say. They're not going to change their mind.
But I also believe that there is a crowd of Americans who are willing to listen and are willing to listen to Bob Mueller and even though he may not be the most dynamic guy in terms of how he answers questions, we're going to be talking about subjects that are very important to our democracy and to our country and I think that people will perk up because of that.
COOPER: Congresswoman Scanlon, what is your measure of success for the hearing tomorrow?
SCANLON: Well, I think it's going to be, if we get the attention of some of those folks who haven't really focused yet -- I mean, do think Bob Mueller is going to come in there and burn down the house? No. But I think it's his gravity and his seriousness and his patriotism that's going to impress the American people.
COOPER: And if all he does essentially is read from the report or recite, you know, in a detailed way through questioning what's in -- you know, specific examples of the president trying to get Don McGahn to create a false record, which is just an extraordinary thing on its face --
SCANLON: It's amazing.
COOPER: Yes, it is incredible. Is that enough?
SCANLON: I think it will be. We've seen for example when Congressman Amash came out and talked about that report for the first time, some people in his district said, wow, I had no idea that was in the report because this fake news has been out there that there was no obstruction, no collusion. That's not what the report says, and I think when people listen, they will come away with a different impression.
COOPER: Congressman Castro, is that your measure of success, as well?
CASTRO: Yes, I think so. And most of all making sure that the truth gets out to the American people on what is a very important subject to our democracy. And, you're right, there are a lot of people that probably 99 percent of Americans did not pick up that Mueller report and read any significant portion of it. So, for millions and millions of viewers, this will be the first time where they are really hearing the substance and some of the details about what was in that report.
COOPER: I want to thank Congressman Castro. Thank you very much for being with us.
[20:15:01] Congresswoman Scanlon, as well. '
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