MSNBC "All in with Chris Hayes" - Transcript: Interview with Rep. Jerry Nadler

Interview

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HAYES: Joining me now, the chairman of that committee, Congressman Jerry  Nadler of  New York. And Chairman, there is a lot to get to, there are questions  about whether Matthew Whitaker perjured himself before your committee.  There are also questions about the Trump Org and their possible message to  you. I want to start with that family separation hearing with Scott Lloyd  today. What did you learn from that hearing today?

REP. JERROLD NADLER, (D-NY) CHAIRMAN HOUSE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE: Well, I  think we learned a number of things. We learned, first all, the  consequences of total lack of oversight by the Republicans over the last  few years that the Trump people thought that they could get away with  everything, and we are bringing some of this to light now. We learned of  the absolute contemptuous attitude that some of these people had toward the  people in their care that they didn`t care at all about the welfare of the  children, that they were perfectly happy in the service of a policy to  scare people away from claiming asylum to tear babies out of the arms of  their parents. They didn`t care about the effects on the babies.

We learned Scott Lloyd, who used his position as the head of Office of  Refugee Resettlement to personally monitor and discourage in every way  teenagers from getting abortions, never talked to his superiors or anyone  else about the effects of tearing babies out of the arms of their mothers.  He only cared about stopping abortions. He didn`t care about the effects  on children.

So, those are some of the things we learned.

And we learned most of all I think the necessity for keeping a spotlight on  what these people are doing because they cannot be trusted not to torture  children.

HAYES: On Scott Lloyd, who is no longer in that role at ORR, if you were  to assess his competence, his ability just to do the job from a 1 to 10  based on what you know and the hearing today, what would you say it was?

NADLER: I would say it was a one, if that much. He had no experience in  the area. He was an anti-abortion zealot, and those were his credentials  to be put in charge of the entire refugee program, which is insane.

HAYES: I want to talk about Matthew Whitaker, too, since I have you here.  Obviously, he came before your committee. There with questions about  whether the president interfered in any  way, talked to him, for instance, about the Southern District of New York.  He seemed to knock that down. And there`s now some question about whether  he perjured himself. House Judiciary Committee believes it has evidence  that President Trump asked Matthew Whitaker -- I`m reading from The Wall  Street Journal -- at the time the acting attorney general, whether  Manhattan U.S. attorney Jeffrey Berman could regain control of his office`s  investigation into Mr. Trump`s former lawyer and his real estate business,  according to people familiar with the matter. What are you going to do  about it?

NADLER: Well, we have reason to believe that he wasn`t completely  forthright with the committee on that and on a couple of other things. And  he has agreed now to come back in front of us and to try to clarify these  matters. And we`re working out a date.

HAYES: So, he`s going to come back?

NADLER: Yes.

HAYES: Will that be voluntary like the last time it was voluntary, and he  told you your time was up?

NADLER: Well, I hope he`s learned a little more humility. His arrogance  was un-befitting any American official.
But at the moment it`s voluntary,  it could be compulsory, if necessary. But right now, he`s cooperating and  we`re work on day to come back and talk to us, and we`ll see what happens  from there.

HAYES: Michael Cohen is going in front of the House Oversight Committee  tomorrow, that is not a committee you chair, that`s a chair by Elijah  Cummings. But I do want to ask you this question, because I have you here. 

You`re a member of congress and you`ve served for awhile. You`ve been in  the minority and you`ve been in the majority. Matt Gates, who is a  Republican, who is a very sort of outspoken advocate for the president,  tweeted this at Michael Cohen, "hey, Michael Cohen, did you wife and  father-in-law know about your girlfriends?" No evidence that he supplies  that. "Maybe tonight would be a good time for that chat. I wonder if  she`ll remain faithful when you`re in prison. She`s about to learn a lot."

Have you ever seen a member of congress make a statement like that in  advance of a witness coming before a House hearing?

NADLER: Well, I don`t know that I`ve seen that, but I`m not going to waste  time responding to every stupid thing that Matt Gates says, but it does  remind me of the president tweeting or talking to Fox News and in effect  threatening Michael Cohen`s father-in-law and that came very close, if it  didn`t cross the line into witness tampering. And I wrote a letter, along  with Chairman Schiff and Chairman Cummings to the president warning him  against witness tampering and other improper actions.

HAYES: Final question about the Trump org. The Washington Post reporting  the Trump Organization had asked House committee to cease investigations,  citing an alleged conflict of interest, and they reproduce a letter there.  Your response to that?

NADLER: Well, it`s nonsense. We`ve retained on contract two very good  people to help us with our investigations of the what`s been going on and  they`ve been vetted very carefully on ethics  and the Kramer Leaven Law Firm (ph) today wrote a letter in effect  dismissing it. It was just nonsense.

HAYES: All right, Congressman Jerry Nadler, thank you for making some  time.

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