Fox News "The Story" - Transcript: The Untold Story of Sen. Susan Collins and the Kavanaugh vote

Interview

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MACCALLUM: Wow. I mean, you can see why they shut the airport down. When you look at the damage on that plane, very serious stuff that is likely to end badly at some point. Trace, thank you very much. Trace Gallagher in Los Angeles.

So, next, exclusive interview with Senator Susan Collins. The untold story which is incredible, behind the vitriol that was directed at her as she debated how to vote on the Brett Kavanaugh nomination.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS (via telephone): Susan Collins should have resigned decades ago. She is too old, too much of a liar, too out of touch of reality and shame on all of you for letting her keep her job.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MACCALLUM: One of the most riveting stories of 2018 was clearly the confirmation of now-Justice Brett Kavanaugh. What seemed like a smooth path to the bench was rocked by 30-year-old allegations of sexual misconduct when a letter surfaced months after it was sent to Capitol Hill. The vote was to be razor tight, and in the end, it came down to one woman.

Senator Susan Collins from Maine, she voted yes and gave a speech that was heralded as one of the best ever in the history of the deliberative body.

But the untold story here is what Susan Collins endured on the way to that moment. She shared details with us that she has never spoken of before. Including men in hazmat suits sent to her home after one envelope was discovered that could have contained ricin, and another with white powder and a chilling note.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

COLLINS: There was an envelope that arrived a few days after the ricin envelope and letter that had white powder in it. Unfortunately, the postal service inspector did a great job intercepting it, and you have to treat everything like that seriously.

It said "anthrax ha, ha, ha." And it was a very difficult time. My husband and our dog, and parts of our house had to be quarantined. Hazmat teams brought in.

But what was even worse was what was done to my staff. They had to be subjected to all sorts of abuse. A 25-year-old caseworker and my staff who deals with social security problems and the V.A. and immigration answered a call in which the men told her that if I voted yes for Justice Kavanaugh, that he hoped she would be raped and impregnated. And unfortunately, I've lost that staff. She just could not take the tremendous abuse that was heaped upon them.

MACCALLUM: I listen to some of the phone call messages that you received. We are just going to play a bit of one of them so people can get a sense of just how brutal the treatment of you was, and it will be, it will bleep out. But here's part of it.

(BEGIN VOICE CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You are so (muted) naive. You will go down in history as the most naive person ever to be in Congress.

(END VOICE CLIP)

MACCALLUM: It's just, it's unbelievable that the rage in these people's voices.

COLLINS: It was unlike anything I have seen in all the years that I have been privileged to serve in the Senate. There was one night I was working very late on the Kavanaugh nomination, I drove myself home at 9.30 at night, I couldn't find a parking space, had to park a block away, and there was a man who had been waiting there for me in the pouring rain and dark.

I look around the streets, there's nobody else out.

MACCALLUM: My gosh.

COLLINS: And he follows me to my house, starts screaming at me, shines a flashlight in my eyes. Turns on a camcorder, and it -- it was frightening. The only funny thing about it, when I finally to door, because I'm frantically trying to unlock my door, and I said you harassing me, and by the way, what's your name and he gave me his name. So, the police were able to--

(CROSSTALK)

MACCALLUM: That was a good idea. Yes, the wherewithal, they are asking me, so did they follow up with him?

COLLINS: They did. But what I'll never understand is why anyone would think that I would be intimidated by those tactics. And that they would be successful in converting me or causing me to vote -- to vote against Judge Kavanaugh, simply because I was threatened.

MACCALLUM: The fiercely contentious confirmation process for Judge Brett Kavanaugh, I want to take you back there and get your reaction.

COLLINS: The whole stage for this very dysfunctional circus that occurred in this nomination was that when Chairman Grassley tried to give an opening statement.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. CHUCK GRASSLEY, R-IA: An exciting day for all of you here--

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Chairman--

GRASSLEY: -- and you are rightly proud of--

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Chairman, if we cannot be recognized, I moved to adjourn.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: And he was not even allowed to finish his opening statement before he was interrupted, and what was clearly an orchestrated move by some of the Democratic senators.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. CORY BOOKER, D-N.J.: We are rushing through this process in a way that is unnecessary.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: I think it's a disservice to the United States Senate. We are better than that, and this is not what the constitutional process of advice and consent is supposed to be about.

I can only hope that this represents a rock-bottom and what has been a steady decline in the dignity and decorum of the nomination process for the Supreme Court nominees over the past three decades.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRISTINE BLASEY FORD, BRETT KAVANAUGH'S ACCUSER: I was pushed onto the bed, and Brett on top of me. I believe he was going to rape me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MACCALLUM: As a senator who had thoughtfully goes to the process and spoken with Brett Kavanaugh for hours and researched his background, what went through your mind when you saw that.

COLLINS: It was painful, it was heart-wrenching, I believed her when she said she was terrified. But she mentioned four people who were there that night, and I felt it was very important that we reopen the FBI investigation to hear what they said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRETT KAVANAUGH, SUPREME COURT JUSTICE: I've never sexually assaulted anyone, not in high school, not in college, not ever.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: When I heard Brett Kavanaugh's rejoinder to it, I heard a man with great anguish and anger who felt falsely accused, so I felt that Dr. Ford certainly had endured a sexually trauma, or some sort of traumatizing incident that upended her life, but I did not find the evidence, any corroboration, in fact, that Brett Kavanaugh was the person who assaulted her.

MACCALLUM: Some of your colleagues said when they watched his reactions, they felt that his temperament was not appropriate for a Supreme Court justice, and they referred it to moments like this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. AMY KLOBUCHAR, D-MINN.: So, you are saying there has never been a case where you drank so much that you didn't remember what happened the night before or part of what happened?

KAVANAUGH: You are asking about blackouts -- I don't know, have you?

KLOBUCHAR: Could you answer the question, judge? I just -- so, you have -- that's not happened, is that your answer?

KAVANAUGH: Yes, and I'm curious if you have.

KLOBUCHAR: I have no drinking problems, judge.

KAVANAUGH: Nor do I.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MACCALLUM: Did you ever find his responses to be inappropriate in that hearing?

COLLINS: That was appropriate. We have to remember that it wasn't just Dr. Ford's accusation, but these outlandish accusations brought by Mike Avenatti and Julie Swetnick, that accused him of drugging girls, teenage girls, so that he could participate in gang rape. So, I think the anger and angst that he felt, and anguish about that, made him less temperate than he should have been in that response.

MACCALLUM: What was it like, you and Lisa Murkowski sort of always seem to fall into that basket of the moderate Republicans that everyone looks to when these votes happen. She decided that she could not be a yes.

COLLINS: We are very good friends. I had talked to her the morning of the vote, the first vote to invoke closure, and then she was still undecided. We sit together on the Senate floor, and she came onto the floor and sat down, and she turned to me, and I thought she said I've decided I can vote for him. I misheard her.

So, I smiled widely, and I said, I'm so relieved that we came to the right conclusion. That we came to the same conclusion. And she said, you misheard me. I said I cannot vote for him. And I'm sure my face fell, but it has not in any way affected our deep friendship, and I respect her opinion, even though I reached a different conclusion.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: The politically charged atmosphere surrounding this nomination has reached a fever pitch.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MACCALLUM: I know, you put a lot of time and thought into the speech that you gave, and it got pretty much everybody stopped, I think in the country and watch, because they didn't know what your final decision was and how you had decided to vote.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: We must always remember that it is when passions are most inflamed that fairness is most in jeopardy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MACCALLUM: That line got a lot of attention.

COLLINS: Well, I felt so strongly that we were really at a critical point for our country, and if we, the Senate confirmation process is not a trial, but there are certain standards that we have to abide by.

And if we were going to throw overboard the presumption of the innocence despite the complete lack of corroborating evidence, even from Dr. Ford's best friend, and if we were going to dispense with fairness, the rule of law, and due process, I really feared for what our country would become, and whether anyone would be willing to put their name forth for public service. Who would go through that?

MACCALLUM: Have you spoken with him since you gave your famous speech?

COLLINS: I have not. I got one text message from him right after it in which he said that he would work hard to make me proud, and the American people proud.

MACCALLUM: Do you think it is rock-bottom? I mean, you know, as Claire McCaskill said, and I think she was sending a message, perhaps, to her fellow Democrats, that this isn't getting us anywhere, folks.

COLLINS: I was so glad when Claire spoke up, because I think it hurt her. I think it hurt Joe Donnelly and Heidi Heitkamp, who also lost their seats. Not because of their votes so much, but because of the spectacle and the unfair treatment of both Judge Kavanaugh and Christine Ford, who asked specifically that her allegations be kept confidential and be handled in a closed session.

MACCALLUM: You went to St. Lawrence University, as did I. They, a letter was circulated, 1,500, something like that, professors and alumni, really wrote a scathing letter saying they wanted to rescind the two honorary degrees that they had given you at your university, which in the past had heralded you for your bipartisan decisions.

COLLINS: It was a very painful experience, because I loved my time at St. Lawrence. When I was at St. Lawrence, free and open debate was encouraged, diverse viewpoints were welcomed, and I could not help but think what has happened, and our students who have more conservative viewpoints discriminated against by professors who say there is only one way to think?

Did they not respect the process that I went through, which I think everyone would concede was extremely thorough? And it made me wonder if our liberal arts colleges are no longer bastions of free speech where people can engage in healthy debate and bring differing viewpoints to the table.

That's what liberal arts college and education is supposed to be all about, and that's what it was like at St. Lawrence when I was there. And I learned so much because of that.

MACCALLUM: What are your thoughts on the Me Too movement?

COLLINS: The Me Too movement has been very important for our country. It's needed and has helped to heighten awareness, and I hope that if there's anything good has come out of this terrible process, it is that the survivors of sexual assault will feel more empowered to come forward, and that they will come forward at the time of the incident, and that they will be heard.

Not everyone is going to be giving an accurate story, but everyone deserves to be treated with respect.

MACCALLUM: It could potentially cost you your election in 2020. Are you at peace with that?

COLLINS: I am. The easier vote politically clearly would have been for me to vote no, but that would not have been the right vote. And I have to live with myself. And I want to be able to look in the mirror in the morning and know that I did what I felt was right, no matter what the consequences may be.

My job as a United States senator is to apply my best judgment, and that's what I did in this case, despite tremendous pressure, horrible tactics, abuse of my family, my staff, and myself. But I really won't ever be intimidated. I have to do what I think is right, and I will let the chips fall where they may.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MACCALLUM: My thanks to Susan Collins for sitting down with me this week. We'll be right back.

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