CNN "State of the Union" - Transcript: Interview With New York Senator Kirsten Gillibrand

Interview

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TAPPER: Welcome back to STATE OF THE UNION. I'm Jake Tapper.

Today is exactly two years until the next presidential inauguration.

And Democratic Senator Kirsten Gillibrand of New York is making her pitch, telling voters in Iowa how she would take on Trump.

[09:25:05]

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TAPPER: Joining me now from West Des Moines, Iowa, Democratic Senator and presidential candidate Kirsten Gillibrand.

Senator, thanks so much for joining us. Congratulations. You just announced your presidential run.

What states do you think that you will be able to win in 2020 if you're the nominee that Democrats were not able to win the last time a New York senator was the nominee, Hillary Clinton?

GILLIBRAND: I think there's a lot of states around this country and a lot of people around this country who are still really unhappy, Jake.

I don't think that those who voted for President Trump necessarily feel that he's done the things that he promised to do. And I am going to talk to all voters about what they care about.

And so far, what I have heard from Iowans is that they care about health care. They care about making sure it's a right, and not a privilege. They care about public schools, that their kids are struggling, class sizes are too big. They want opportunities for their kids. And they care about better jobs, better pay and being able to provide for their families.

And so I think, if I travel around this country and listen to folks about what they care about, and then fight for them as hard as I would fight for my own kids, as hard as I would fight for my own community, I think I can win back voters anywhere, because it's about them and their lives and just having someone who will fight for them.

TAPPER: Let's talk about the deal that President Trump just put on the table to extend, temporarily, protections for some dreamers and undocumented immigrants brought to the U.S. as children, people with temporary protective status, in exchange for wall funding.

You called it a bad deal.

GILLIBRAND: Yes.

TAPPER: In your campaign announcement, you suggested more bipartisan in Washington.

GILLIBRAND: Yes.

TAPPER: You said you're going to -- quote -- "bring people together to start getting things done."

So, OK, you think it's a bad deal. What's your counteroffer?

GILLIBRAND: So, my counteroffer would be what we put on the table a year ago and voted for, which was protect all dreamers, protect TPS status.

We, as Democrats, certainly care about national security and border security. We have always cared about that. And so we don't mind investing in that. But we really want to protect the people who need our help right now. And then we can create a comprehensive immigration system that actually understands that people who are seeking asylum are helped.

And so that's the deal we should be talking about, protecting all dreamers, not -- and permanently, a pathway to citizenship, because the truth is, Jake, when I have met with dreamers, they're struggling. They have so much anxiety and fear they might not be able to finish college. They might be serving in the military. They might have families.

TAPPER: So...

GILLIBRAND: They -- these are things that are hurting and harming people.

And for him to say three years, again, he has no compassion, he has no empathy for the people who actually are suffering because of his decisions.

TAPPER: So, a wall for dreamers is something that you would be willing to go along with, as long as it was permanent protection for dreamers and DACA recipients?

GILLIBRAND: Border security and investing in keeping us safe is a better way to talk about it, because a wall is a waste of money and will not actually help us create safety.

We also recognize, like, we can spend money on making sure we stop drug trafficking and human trafficking and cross-border terrorism. That's what certainly I care about, and we can invest in that.

TAPPER: All right. You have said Trump's immigration positions are racist. That's the word you used, racist.

Now, as you know, you were more conservative early on in your career on immigration. CNN's KFILE is out with a new report this week on your 2008 campaign Web site and a mailer sent from your congressional office back then, a long time ago, but still in your -- in your public life.

Take a look. You said you were a -- quote -- "firm opponent" of government -- quote -- "amnesty to illegal aliens" -- unquote. You said English should be -- quote -- "the official language of the United States." You called for expediting deportation of undocumented immigrants. I know you have very different positions today.

GILLIBRAND: Yes.

TAPPER: But, let me ask you, if Trump's immigration positions are racist, were they racist when you held some of those positions as well?

GILLIBRAND: They certainly weren't empathetic, and they weren't kind, and I did not think about suffering in other people's lives.

And one thing I did 10 years ago, when I became senator and was going to represent 20 million people across our state, I recognized that a lot of places in my state were different, and I needed to understand what those constituents needed too. And so I took the time.

I went down to Brooklyn. I met with Nydia Velazquez, who has been a leader fighting for families for a long time. And I listened. And I realized that things I had said were wrong. I was not caring about others. I was not fighting for other people's kids, the same way I was fighting for my own. And I was wrong to feel that way.

And so I just said I'm not going to stand by and do nothing for families that are suffering in my state and in my communities.

TAPPER: So, what's the difference, though, just help me understand, between your previous positions, which you characterize as wrong and not empathetic, and President Trump's positions today that you call racist?

GILLIBRAND: So, what President Trump is doing is creating fear and division and a darkness across this country that I have never seen before.

One of the reasons I'm running for president, Jake, is because we have to restore that integrity to our presidency, to this country. We have always cared about others. We have always believed in the golden rule.

[09:30:01]

And what President Trump is doing is destroying the moral fabric of what this country stands for. We have the Statue of Liberty in our New York Harbor. She stands for a beacon of light and hope for others who need us. Send us your huddled masses yearning to breathe free.

We have never been afraid of immigrants. We have never been afraid of refugees and asylum-seekers.

This president has sown fear and division that just makes us weaker. And so I think what he's done is so horrible and so mean-spirited, that I am nothing like him and never will be, because my values haven't changed.

I will fight for other people's kids as hard as I will fight for my own. (CROSSTALK)

TAPPER: Some cities in the United States, such as San Francisco, allow undocumented immigrants to vote in local elections.

You recently came out in support of allowing undocumented immigrants to obtain driver's licenses.

GILLIBRAND: Yes.

TAPPER: How do you feel about undocumented immigrants across the country being able to vote in local elections?

GILLIBRAND: I think the vote is for American citizens.

And it's really important that we give immigrants a pathway to citizenship through comprehensive immigration reform, so they can be part of all the blessings of America.

When you create a pathway to citizenship, Jake, you allow people to buy into their Social Security. You allow them to invest in our public schools. You allow them to invest in their future and pay taxes.

All those things is why you need a pathway to citizenship. And so I really hope we can do that through comprehensive immigration reform.

TAPPER: So that seems like a no. You don't support that.

During your reelection bid..

GILLIBRAND: Correct. I don't.

TAPPER: Yes.

GILLIBRAND: I think it's for American citizens.

TAPPER: During your reelection bid for the U.S. Senate last fall, you made a promise to your constituents. Take a listen.

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TAPPER: The "Buffalo News" editorial board is calling this a flat-out lie.

What's your response?

GILLIBRAND: I told the "Buffalo News" board and I told you and everyone last year that I was solely focused on 2018, because the crisis at the moment was trying to create a check on President Trump.

We needed to flip the House of Representatives, hold as many seats in the Senate. And I wanted to continue to serve New Yorkers. I will always fight for New Yorkers, and I'm still fighting for New Yorkers.

But after we were able to flip the House of Representatives, I took a long, hard thought with my family about whether this is something we should consider, whether this is a battle that is something that we should take on as a family. It's a -- it's an issue that I had to talk to my boys about, the sacrifices they will make.

And I needed time to make that decision, a real decision, about whether this is something that I believe I'm called to do. And I do believe that. And that's why I'm running.

TAPPER: But it was three days after...

GILLIBRAND: But, at the time I said that, Jake -- it's not three days, Jake. It's over the last few months.

TAPPER: No, no, no, but it was after -- it was after three days after you were elected that you said you were going to consider running for president, three days after you were...

GILLIBRAND: Exactly, because I told you before I ran that I needed to focus solely on electing a Democratic majority, because that's the crisis we're in right now.

And it takes time to think about these things. And I could not have done that before, because I was focused on trying to win back the House, holding the Senate, and focused on New Yorkers.

TAPPER: Obviously, you being the first person to call -- first Democratic senator, I should say, to call for then Minnesota Senator Al Franken to resign amid sexual misconduct allegations has been brought up on the campaign trail.

You have faced some blowback from members of your own party for that, from Democratic donors. Now, you told our reporter CNN's Dan Merica that you think some of the blowback is sexist.

Why do you think that?

GILLIBRAND: Well, it is.

And many people are very sad about Senator Franken, but the truth is, he had eight credible allegations of groping and sexual harassment against him that were corroborated in real time. The eighth one happened to be a congressional staffer, someone who works in my place of work. And, for me, enough was enough.

I have been leading on these issues for the past six years, speaking out against sexual assault in the military, against sexual assault on college campuses, sexual harassment in Congress. And I had one decision to make, Jake.

And that was whether to continue to stay silent and not stand with those women who came forward. It's very hard to do.

I also am a mom of young sons, as you know. And, at home, I was having conversations with Theo, who's 15, about what was going on. And he didn't understand why I was so tough on Al Franken.

And it was very clear to me that I needed to be clear with him that groping a woman or forcibly kissing a woman without her consent is not OK. It's not OK for a U.S. senator, and it's not OK for my son. And so there was no room for ambiguity there.

Now, that was my decision, my decision to not remain silent. Senator Franken made his own decision. He was entitled to whatever process he wanted. He was entitled to stay in the Senate as long as he wanted. He chose to resign.

[09:35:03]

And if some very wealthy donors in our party are angry about that, that's on them.

TAPPER: You're going to be competing with a very, very crowded field of Democrats that includes the most diverse slate of Democratic candidates or any candidates in any party in the history of this nation, several women, several African-Americans, Latino candidates.

Why should voters, why should Democrats go with you? What distinguishes you from Warren, Sherrod Brown, Kamala Harris, et cetera?

GILLIBRAND: Well, a couple of things.

We are all who we are. And I think it's great that we have so many amazing candidates running.

I'm a mom with young kids. I look at the world as my mission to fight for other people's kids as hard as I would fight for my own, which is why I believe health care should be a right, not a privilege. It's why I believe we need better public schools, which I have heard from voters all across this country. They just care about their kids.

It's why I believe, if you want to work hard, you should be able to earn your way into the middle class with better job training, better job opportunities, the ability to organize and have unions in this country, the ability to reward work and have national paid leave or equal pay or affordable day care, things that would really make a difference.

But if you're going to do any of those things, Jake, you have to have the courage to take on the systems of power that make it impossible. So, if you want gun reform, you got to take on the NRA, and you have got to actually name it for what it is, which is greed and corruption.

You have to be able to take on the insurance companies that don't want health care as a right, and not a privilege, or the drug companies that don't want you to buy in bulk and get cheaper drugs for Medicare patients. Those are the battles that have to be fought. And I believe that I

have the courage, the conviction and the determination to do all those things.

I also have a track record. I have a track record of getting those things done in my state, a state that's very diverse. You know my state. Upstate New York is red, very red. It was red on Election Day. Upstate New York voted for President Trump. Westchester and Long Island are purple. On Election Day, they voted for President Trump.

And New York City, which is blue, deep blue -- and I, in my state, have brought people together. I have had the highest vote margins in history of the state, with 72 percent, than any other statewide Democrat.

And so my track record is passing legislation, like the 9/11 health bill, don't ask, don't tell repeal...

TAPPER: Yes.

GILLIBRAND: ... which I can explain to your viewers, if they need.

But getting -- bringing people together -- and even in this Congress, a Democrat -- a Republican-controlled House, Republican-controlled Senate, and president who is a Republican, I passed over a dozen bills in the last Congress helping people to have made-in-America manufacturing, get more access to capital for small businesses, the bread-and-butter stuff that makes communities thrive.

And that's why I think I can break through and actually serve and represent everyone.

TAPPER: All right, Senator Kirsten Gillibrand, Democrat of New York, 2020 candidate, thanks so much for joining us. We appreciate it.

GILLIBRAND: Thanks, Jake.

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