CNN "The Situation Room" - Transcript: Interview With New York Congressman Hakeem Jeffries

Interview

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ACOSTA: That's right. OK, Sara Murray, all right, thank you very much. We appreciate it.

Let's talk about the Russia investigation and the government shutdown with Congressman Hakeem Jeffries, a Democrat who serves on the Budget and Judiciary Committees.

Congressman, thanks for joining us. Happy holidays. We appreciate you coming in.

REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D), NEW YORK: Thank you.

ACOSTA: Thank you.

And let me ask you about what the president has been saying today. He is now saying that Democratic opposition isn't about the wall, but about not letting Donald Trump and the Republicans have a win.

What is your response to that accusation?

JEFFRIES: Well, clearly, Donald Trump is in the middle of another presidential temper tantrum.

Let's just look at the facts here. Repeatedly, Donald Trump has said to the American people that he's going to build the wall, and Mexico is going to pay for it.

So, if Mexico is going to pay for it, go negotiate with Mexico. Instead, what he's done is shut down the government and tried to stick the American taxpayer with a $5 billion ransom note to build a medieval border wall.

It's like a fifth century solution to a 21st century problem, and it's not going anywhere.

ACOSTA: And, Congressman, I want you to listen to what the House Freedom Caucus chairman, Mark Meadows, told our Dana Bash earlier today. He thinks Democrats -- or he's saying that Democrats were never serious about this negotiation.

Let's listen to that.

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ACOSTA: Your response to the congressman on that?

JEFFRIES: Well, listen, we have a broken immigration system. It clearly deserves to be fixed. We need to do it through comprehensive immigration reform.

And Democrats of course are willing to take steps -- take steps in that regard. I think what Leader Pelosi, soon to be speaker, has clearly said, along with House Democrats, is that we're willing to take a look at enhancing border security through technology, through satellites, through drones, throwing enhanced fencing, through a variety of things that the experts have said will actually enhance border security.

Donald Trump has put forth what is a political ploy in terms of his wall. He fed that misinformation to his base. And now he's trying to save face. And that's why we're in the midst of a government shutdown. And it's unfortunate, Jim.

ACOSTA: And so, at this point, you're saying no wall, the president is not going to get any funding for a wall. You were just saying a moment ago, you can call it border security, you can talk about technology, additional resources at the border, but the president is not going to be receiving funding for his border wall.

Is that what you're saying, Congressman, when we go into the new year, and the Democrats take control of the House?

JEFFRIES: Well, what I'm saying is that we should have a substantive discussion about what is effective in terms of enhancing security on the border.

And the experts have made clear that a border wall is not the solution. This is over 200 mile -- 2,000 miles of terrain that's very different in nature. There are some areas where perhaps enhanced fencing makes sense, other areas where technology in terms of satellites make sense.

There are other areas where you can look at supplementing the personnel. Perhaps that makes sense. But a border wall, again, is just simply something that was a campaign promise. And as a result of the fact that he's failed to deliver on that, you have got some right- wing pundits like Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity and others who basically have punked the president of the United States into a shutdown.

Congress was prepared to fund the Department of Homeland Security and do it in a bipartisan way. Vice President Mike Pence had indicated that the administration was prepared to sign a clean funding bill. And then the right-wing hit squad acted up, and Donald Trump was spooked.

And that's why we're in the midst of a government shutdown right now that is costing the taxpayers each and every day that it goes on.

ACOSTA: Aren't you concerned, though, Congressman, that you may start sharing some of the blame once you come into power come January, when Nancy Pelosi is handed that gavel, if you're not coming to the table with some kind of funding that meets the president halfway?

[18:15:12]

It sounds as though you guys are now saying, it's our way or the highway. Do you run the risk of being blamed for some of this when you come into power early next year?

JEFFRIES: Well, first of all, President Trump made clear to the American people and to the world as he sat at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue and said he's going to shut down the government. It's his shutdown. Now, I think what we have put on the table is approximately $1.3

billion in security funding. And that is more than sufficient.

As you know, Jim, approximately, that same amount was previously allocated in the last fiscal year, and the Trump administration has spent approximately 6 percent of that money. So, why in the world would Congress, as stewards of taxpayer dollars, allocate an additional $5 billion on top of that, when the Trump administration hasn't even demonstrated the basic competence to spend the money that we have already allocated to them?

It's ridiculous.

ACOSTA: Well, it sounds like the president is not going to get wall money in the new year, is what it sounds like.

JEFFRIES: Well, that would be a waste of taxpayer dollars. And I think, consistent with the Constitution and the Origination Clause, we do in the House have a responsibility to make sure that we allocate money in a manner that benefits the taxpayers.

And I think that's what we intend to do. We'd like to do it in a bipartisan way. But we're not going to function as wholly owned subsidiaries of the Trump administration. That's what our colleagues on the other side of the aisle have done for the last two years, and that ends on January 3. Those days over.

ACOSTA: OK.

Let me move to the Russia investigation, because, as you probably saw earlier today, Congressman, in a pair of interviews, Rudy Giuliani was really offering conflicting information as to whether or not the president would be open to taking more questions from the special counsel, Robert Mueller.

First, he says, not over my dead body. And then he said to "The Hill," we're not going to do that. We're done talking to those folks.

But then he seemed to crack the door open a little bit with The Daily Beast. How do you interpret these remarks? They seem to be all over the place.

JEFFRIES: First of all, does anyone take Rudy Giuliani seriously at this point? I mean, he was a failed mayor. Then he was a failed presidential candidate. Now he's a failed lawyer.

And, clearly, he's just engaged in public relations spin. The bottom line here is that we have to allow the Mueller investigation simply to proceed, so we can get the facts city American people. He's undertaking a very serious investigation.

The allegations here are that the Trump campaign engage in a conspiracy with Russian spies and operatives in order to sell out our democracy and artificially place Donald Trump in the Oval Office. That's a serious thing. The American people deserve answers. And we shouldn't do anything prematurely in the House or Donald Trump's lawyers shouldn't do anything prematurely to short-circuit that investigation.

Let Bob Mueller allow the facts and the evidence to come to light, and then we can figure out what happened here and what the consequences should be thereafter.

ACOSTA: And the president was complaining that Democratic oversight of his administration is going to amount to what he called presidential harassment. What did you make of that when you heard that one?

JEFFRIES: I mean, again, he needs another civic and constitutional lesson.

What he calls presidential harassment, basically, is the fact that the House of Representatives is an Article 1 separate and co-equal branch of government. James Madison and Ben Franklin and the other founding fathers erected a system where the House and the Senate would serve as a check and balance on an out-of-control executive branch.

And to the extent that that is our constitutional obligation and responsibility, we are going to undertake that, not overreach, not overinvestigate, but be stewards of the American taxpayer, expose any wrongdoing or waste of taxpayer dollars or abuse, waste, fraud that may be taking place, and then let the American people make decisions about how to proceed from there.

ACOSTA: OK. Congressman Hakeem Jeffries of New York, thank you so much for coming in. Happy new year. Happy holidays. We appreciate you coming on.

JEFFRIES: Happy new year. Thanks a lot, Jim.

ACOSTA: All right, thank you.

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