CNN "CNN Newsroom" - Transcript: Interview with Rep. Ralph Norman (R-SC) and Rep. Kurt Schrader (D-OR)

Interview

BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT

BALDWIN: OK, ladies, thank you. Thank you for rolling with me through this.

My next guests say, if Congress can't do their jobs and fix this shutdown crisis, then they shouldn't get paid. And the twist is, they're members of Congress.

Joining me now, Democratic Congressman Kurt Schrader of Oregon and Republican Ralph Norman of South Carolina.

Gentlemen, welcome.

REP. KURT SCHRADER (D), OREGON: Hi.

REP. RALPH NORMAN (R), SOUTH CAROLINA: Glad to be here, yes.

BALDWIN: So, you all, along with about 100 of your colleagues, are asking for your pay to be withheld. And we will get to that and how you all agree when it comes to your paycheck in just a minute.

But, first, this back and forth between Speaker Pelosi and President Trump, he says the State of the Union is on. She says it's off. And now he's calling Democrats radicalized and says this will -- he will respond later. So this has become an even bigger spectacle.

[15:10:08]

Congressman Schrader, do you approve of Speaker Pelosi's actions?

SCHRADER: Well, Ralph and I are rank-and-file members. That's at a level of engagement way above our pay grade. And we're interested in trying to get this shutdown over with. I

think that's something Republicans and Democrats agree with. We may disagree a little bit about the elements and what's important, but we're hopeful people will sit down and start talking.

But we do agree that you shouldn't get paid in Congress if you're shutting down the government. We don't know any job you get...

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Congressman, hang on. I got to jump in, because, listen -- and we -- I promise we will get to that.

But I have to get you on the record commenting on this spectacle. The fact that the president of the United States will not be going and speaking in front of you all next Tuesday night is a significant development.

SCHRADER: Well, I'm not a big fan of the State of the Union stuff anyway. I'm not a pomp and circumstance guy. So, it doesn't really affect me personally.

The president, I'm sure, can make a statement wherever he wants. That's his right, his constitutional privilege. Doesn't have to do it here in the halls of Congress.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: He's not constitutionally obligated to do this?

SCHRADER: No, he is not. He has an opportunity -- not in Congress anyway.

He has an opportunity in the Constitution to make a statement to Congress at a time and place of his choosing. Historically, in recent times, it's been here in the speaker's -- in the House of Representatives chamber.

But it can be anywhere, frankly. And if he and the speaker are squabbling, he has a right to go and have that statement anywhere he wants.

BALDWIN: And how, sir, do you see -- Congressman Norman, how do you see -- do you see your fellow congressman there as the radical left, as the president characterized it? And do you see him as someone who doesn't care about violence and folks who shouldn't be coming into America coming into America, as the president says?

NORMAN: I think what we all agree on is that, as Congressman Schrader says, we don't like the shutdown.

We think -- going into day 34, but as far as -- it could be over pretty quick if we could agree on the wall funding. Now, I do agree with that. I think the president is making the right call.

On the fact of being able not to deliver it in the Capitol, I was telling Kurt it was shocking. I just didn't -- I heard that right before we came on the air. But it's sad that it gets to that point.

I will tell you, the address will go on. It will be at another venue. And so the country will get to hear the address. It just won't be here.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Where would you like it to be, sir? Where would you like it to be?

NORMAN: I will let the president decide that. He can go wherever he wants to go.

If it's not here, he can go to the Senate, if they agree, which I understand they would. But I think he will pick a place that will be suitable and be apropos.

BALDWIN: And to what you two agree on -- and it's appreciated why you two gentlemen don't want to collect this paycheck as members of Congress in solidarity of these federal workers.

But what about the other members of Congress who aren't jumping on board with you all? Just to both of you, what is their reasoning? What have they told you?

NORMAN: Well, that's their right.

I don't condemn anybody. I mean, Kurt are I are from the private sector. We believe, and as well as a lot of others, that if you don't go to work, you don't get paid. You don't get a check.

That's the American way in our minds. So but how -- how and why other people do it, don't do it, that's up to them to decide.

SCHRADER: And there's a lot of people that are not wealthy here, believe it or not, and we have -- we were just talking, a lot of members with younger families, and they maybe have a mortgage back home. They have a mortgage here.

It gets complicated pretty quick. But the idea behind our bill is just to put pressure on all of us, so that we actually have to get down to the table and start negotiating and come up with a deal at the end of the day.

That's what we're trying to do with the constitutional amendment and with the hold Congress accountable bill that we've introduced.

BALDWIN: And, lastly, when you hear the president say this government shutdown will go on for awhile, to that, you say what?

NORMAN: Well, I think he's prepared to.

I think we're at a logger jam. I think we will. It will be until the wall gets funded. And I know that a lot of people don't agree with that, but I think the majority will. But until -- if the wall is not funded, we will be here indefinitely. BALDWIN: Congressman Schrader?

(CROSSTALK)

SCHRADER: Well, I don't know about the wall itself. Some physical barriers may be in play. We have done that obviously before.

Certainly need to talk about the real problem at hand, which is those families at the border, where Ralph and I both visited down that way. The facilities are inadequate. There's not enough judges, not enough lawyers to process these people in a timely manner.

I think there's a deal to be had. We're not there yet. Immigration has been a thorny issue in this country for as long as we have been here, frankly. But I think we can get it done once people decide to get past the talking points, decide to sit down and negotiate.

[15:15:05]

BALDWIN: Appreciate both of you all joining me from both parties standing side by side up on Capitol Hill. We need more of that.

Gentlemen, thank you very much.

NORMAN: Our pleasure.

SCHRADER: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Thank you.

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