CNN "Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees" - Transcript: Interview with Senator Angus King of Maine

Interview

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COOPER: That's the president's -- one of his go-to lines that people are talking about it. That's like a new off shot of it, oh, people are suggesting a prorated down payment. It's all you hear about when you're on the subway these days. People are talking about this.

Anyway, Kaitlan Collins, thank you very much.

Shortly before air time I spoke with Maine Independent Senator Angus King who caucuses with Democrats and voted today for the Democratic shutdown bill.

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[20:10:07] COOPER: Senator King, since you voted earlier today, the president has said he is open to a, quote, prorated down payment on a border wall. He says he'll reopen the government in three weeks if Democrats agree to that.

Are you entirely clear on what that actually means? Would you support it?

SEN. ANGUS KING (I), MAINE: Well, I am unclear on what it actually means. But the concept is that he's still trying to bargain about opening the government. And part of the whole purpose of what we were talking about today is let's get the government open, take a deep breath, consider his proposal in a rational, reasonable, process way and come to some conclusion that I think we're going to be able to work something out that he can support.

But he's putting on this extra condition, which is basically, you know, he is doling out, you know, time, and we're talking about people's lives here, Anderson. That's what's been missing somewhat.

I mean, these are real people's lives. We've got Coast Guard people in Maine who are going to food banks.

COOPER: I mean, more senators voted today in favor of the Democrats' plans than the president's plan. Neither plan got the 60 votes needed to end debate. But do you believe unity among Senate Republicans is in any way starting to fracture? Majority Leader McConnell is under more pressure?

KING: Well, yes. I wouldn't put it that way. I would say everybody in the Senate wants this thing solved.

One of the indications of that is after the two amendments failed, Ben Cardin of Maryland put in an amendment that is just a simple three- week continuing resolution, and we all stood up and talked about a commitment. There were 15 of us that spoke on the floor, I was one of them that said look, I'm for border security, and I'm willing to work in good faith on a solution. As I left the floor, I asked Ben Cardin, and he had -- I think he had five Republican co-sponsors at that time, and I think there are more to come.

Everybody wants to get to a solution here, and I just wish the president would put a little faith in the process. And, you know, he came in with a budget last January, Anderson, for $1.6 billion for border security, and he got it. It went through the appropriations committee. It was approved. It was in the bill that went through the Senate -- the Senate Appropriations Committee and the House Appropriations Committee.

And so I guess what I'm saying is that's evidence that we can act in good faith and we can do something serious about border security. Will it be 5.7 or 2.8 or 6, I'm not going to negotiate here on television, but I think there is room to reach a reasonable accommodation.

COOPER: But it was clear he backed off that after getting criticism essentially from right-wing radio and television that it wasn't following through on his promise to build a wall. Why would he give up leverage or alleged leverage of the actual shutdown if he doesn't feel he's going to get some sort of wall?

KING: Remember, we're not talking about full funding of the government until September, which is what we ought to be doing, but we're talking about three weeks. We're basically saying lay the hammer aside and let us work on it for three weeks in good faith and let's see what we can come up with.

In the meantime, let's let these good people get paid, go back to work, do what they ought to do. And if it doesn't work out, you know, he's still got that --

COOPER: Got the leverage.

KING: That tool, which I think is inappropriate, by the way. It's a terrible way to govern. But he's not really giving up that much. He's just giving Congress a

chance to try to digest what he's asking for.

COOPER: CNN's reporting that the White House is preparing a draft national emergency declaration for the president to sign in order to use military funding to build the wall. Would that at this point be the easiest way to actually end the shutdown? It would almost surely end up in court, but wouldn't it get the government reopen right away?

KING: Well, it probably would. It's good news and bad news. The good news is it would almost certainly end the shutdown. It's bad news in that this isn't the way our system is designed.

The Constitution says money spent is appropriated by Congress. And that's one of our fundamental functions. And to establish a precedent that the president can basically decree a national emergency and then do whatever he or she wants in the terms of policy that they can't get through the Congress is a terrible precedent, and to me, it's a gross violation of constitutional principles.

So they may be looking in that direction. And as I say, in the short- term, you'd say oh, good, the shutdown is over, and that's a good thing for sure. But if that's the solution, boy is it a dangerous way.

This is exactly what the framers were worried about. They didn't want a monarch. They wanted a constitutional democracy and they wanted a president and checks and balances, and they purposefully put the power of the purse in the Congress. And that's the way it ought to be.

COOPER: Senator King, I appreciate your time. Thank you.

KING: Yes, sir.

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