CNN "CNN Newsroom" - Transcript: Interview with Rep. Jim Himes (D), Connecticut

Interview

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SCIUTTO: Today, a full CIA report is expected on the murder of journalist Jamal Khashoggi. The pressure growing on President Trump to hear that report and take action. Senate Foreign Relations Chairman, Bob Corker, Republican, of course, warned in a statement to CNN that Congress will act if the White House does not sanction specifically the Saudi crown prince.

Let's discuss now with Democratic Congressman Jim Himes of Connecticut. He is on the House Intelligence Committee.

Congressman, thanks for taking the time this morning.

REP. JIM HIMES (D), CONNECTICUT: Good morning, Jim.

SCIUTTO: First of all, Congressman, we have seen this president publicly reject the findings of the intelligence community on Russian interference in the election, on North Korean nuclear activity despite ongoing nuclear talks. Are you concerned that the president will reject what appears to be a substantial CIA report finding the crown prince directly responsible for Khashoggi's murder?

HIMES: Yes, of course I am. I mean, as you point out, facts unearthed by the intelligence community that are inconvenient to the president's conception of himself get dismissed. And I'll tell you, there's a whole other set of things that happens when people who work hard in places like the CIA and the NSA have their work dismissed by their boss, that creates a real problem for the United States. But look, it's clear that this president is enthrall to the Saudi

royal house and the crown prince in particular, as he is with dictators all over the world, whether it's the president of the Philippines or Putin. He's quick to criticize every other human on the planet, other than those fairly murderous dictators that he bizarrely seems to find an awful lot of sympathy for.

[10:20:04] SCIUTTO: Let me ask you this, so you've heard and seen Senator Bob Corker in the other chamber, his commitment here to push for actions to specifically punish the crown prince. Democrats now have control of the House. Have you had conversations with your GOP colleagues about a bipartisan effort in the House and in the Senate to hold the president accountable here, in effect, to push him to action against Saudi Arabia and the crown prince?

HIMES: Yes, and of course, Jim, you've seen this movie before with respect to Russia, where when the president was waffling on whether there should be sanctions on Russia, the Congress actually unified and stepped up and forced the president to impose sanctions.

I think you're going to see a similar effort with respect to Saudi Arabia. You know, and it's not just related to this awful, awful killing of Khashoggi. One of the things that has come out of this whole episode of course has been to open a whole lot of (INAUDIBLE) in Yemen, where hundreds of thousands of very desperate and poor people are dead with U.S. complicity, with the U.S. taxpayer dollar being used to assist the Saudis and prosecuting a brutal, brutal war.

And by the way, prosecuting it very badly, with the targeting of innocent people, with military incompetence on an epic scale. So yes, there is on both sides of the aisle in the Congress a desire to really demonstrate our concern with the crown prince, not just on Khashoggi, but on a number of other things he has, I think, unwisely done around the world.

SCIUTTO: CNN reporting the discovered U.S. weapons being used in some of those strikes on civilians there in Yemen.

I want to ask you about the situation for Nancy Pelosi because the math here is difficult for the punitive speaker of the House, and we're going to throw this up on screen because you had 16 Democrats sign pledges in the midterms not to vote for her. Fifteen of whom now have won their seats. Her margin, she can only lose 15 Democrats, as you can see there. From where you're sitting is Nancy Pelosi in danger, does she not have the votes to be the speaker of the House?

HIMES: Well, to be clear, Jim, she has the vast majority of the Democratic caucus on her side. And that of course --

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SCIUTTO: But not enough. But not enough.

HIMES: Right.

SCIUTTO: Not enough of a margin of safety there. HIMES: Well, to get the nomination, she's easily got that, but then

there's the question of what happens on the floor, which is your question. And look, I know a lot of the people who are making a stand here, and I don't think they're going to be subject to persuasion. What I do hope, and I think this is the important thing, Jim.

They're running a play, and their play is if we can deny Nancy Pelosi the votes on the floor and maybe do that a couple of times so that there's gridlock and uncertainty about where we go, maybe at that point, a white knight or what have you, emerges. Somebody else.

That's a real gamble. And I think that's partly why they're having trouble getting momentum because nobody has emerged. So I guess my hope, Jim, this is the important thing. If they run that play, and it looks like they're going to run that play, they need to agree for the purpose of Democratic unity, that if they run the play and the play fails, that they stand down.

Look, they've got the right to do what they're doing on the floor, and some as you point out new members have promised their constituents that they will do that. What we can't have this do is extend into a protracted period of disunity and argument. Let them run their play, if the play fails, they need to stand down and let Nancy Pelosi be speaker of the House.

SCIUTTO: Let me ask you about the president's new acting attorney general, Matthew Whitaker. The Democratic minority leader of the Senate, Chuck Schumer, he has sent a letter to the DOJ requesting a probe into potentially unlawful communication between the president and Matthew Whitaker regarding the Russia probe.

I'll remind you, historians will remind us that one of the Articles of Impeachment against President Nixon was for communication with Justice Department officials involved in an investigation into himself. In your view, if those communications are discovered and substantiated, would that be an impeachable offense?

HIMES: Impeachable of the president, you mean?

SCIUTTO: Impeachable offense by the president for -- if it's established that he communicated with the acting attorney general about an ongoing investigation?

HIMES: Yes, look. Obviously, that really depends on the facts. And you know, I don't want to join the gang in speculating about impeachment. You know, we have deliberately tried in the spirit of, you know, trying to repair deep splits in the Congress to not go every time the president, you know, is accused of doing something wrong, which of course, is on a daily basis, to not go to impeachment.

What we can say, Jim, is look. Whitaker would not have been on anybody's top 30 list of candidates for attorney general, so why is he acting attorney general? To me, the answer seems pretty clear, which is this is a guy who said he didn't like the Russia investigation, who apparently supported the president, and so there's going to be a lawsuit to determine if he needs to be Senate confirmed. [10:25:05] The investigation you're talking could happen to see if the

president deliberately trying to obstruct that investigation. But if nothing else, it's very clear that the acting attorney general should recuse himself, because there's no way he can oversee an investigation that he disparaged with the kind of impartiality that all Americans would expect of the Department of Justice.

SCIUTTO: Congressman Jim Himes, thanks very much.

HIMES: Thanks, Jim.

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