NBC "Meet the Press" - Transcript: Interview with Sen. Dick Durbin

Interview

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CHUCK TODD:

Joining me now from Chicago is the Senate Democratic Whip, Dick Durbin. Senator Durbin, welcome back to Meet the Press, sir.

SEN. DICK DURBIN:

Good to be with you, Chuck.

CHUCK TODD:

I know you couldn't see that package, but you could hear it. That last voice in there was the former Tennessee Governor Phil Bredesen, who is running for that U.S. Senate seat in Tennessee, calling for a, quote, "change of players," when it comes to the Democratic leadership. You're a member of this Democratic leadership. When you hear that, is there going to be a change of players, between yourself, Senator Schumer, Nancy Pelosi? Or make your case for why it isn't necessary.

SEN. DICK DURBIN:

Chuck, that's tomorrow's newspaper. Today's newspaper is about an election on November 6th. And let me tell you what we're doing. We're focusing on the issues that make a difference. I know that you probably had the pre-existing condition phrase in there a dozen times in that lead-in. That's because the American people put that as the highest priority. They want protection for their families. They know the Republicans have voted consistently to take away that protection and filed lawsuits to end it. That's why it's such an important issue, over and over again, on a local basis.

CHUCK TODD:

But let me go back to this leadership issue. You heard -- the other voice in there was Kyrsten Sinema, the Democratic nominee in Arizona, saying, "People don't like parties anymore." And obviously, both parties are unpopular in our poll right now. Is that a problem for you, that there are voters out there that you need to win over, who don't like the Democratic Party, but you're having to basically make the case, "Hey, you may not like us. But don't you like the other side worse -- less?"

SEN. DICK DURBIN:

Well, it gets down to this, Chuck. There are more and more independent voters. And I think Kyrsten's correct in making that assertion. But the bottom line is, we are doing well with those independent voters. Take a look at what Mitch McConnell gave us this last week: an insight into where the Republicans are going if they continue to control Congress. In order to deal with the deficits they've created with the tax bill for the wealthy people and special interests, they are going to cut Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid. Those are fightin' words for a lot of people, not just Democrats, but independents, as well. Pre-existing conditions, making sure that Social Security and Medicare and Medicaid are strong for years to come, that's a good basis to get a lot of people elected to Congress.

CHUCK TODD:

I want to play for you an ad that Jacky Rosen, she's the Democratic nominee running in Nevada, it's interesting, in the message she's trying to send to Nevada voters, which may surprise some viewers. Take a listen.

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CHUCK TODD:

So here's a Democratic Senate candidate in Nevada talking about legislation that she got signed by President Trump and, essentially, trying to distance herself from House Democratic Leader Nancy Pelosi. What does that say about the power of the anti-Trump message these days?

SEN. DICK DURBIN:

I can tell you, Jacky Rosen, obviously, knows the pulse of Nevada. And she has come forward with a message that plays across the United States: agree with the president when he's right, be prepared to fight him, if necessary, when he's wrong. I'm working with the administration to disclose the cost of prescription drugs on the ads they put on television. Secretary Azar of the Trump administration, whom I did not vote for in the cabinet, is working with me. I'd be glad to tell the people of Illinois and anywhere that that's an important issue we can work on together. But there are many differences. And they get down to pre-existing conditions, these basic entitlement programs, and making sure that this president has someone in Congress who's going to keep an eye on him when he goes to an extreme position.

CHUCK TODD:

One of the other messages in that ad, obviously, was Jacky Rosen trying to distance herself from the Nancy Pelosi attacks. I'm curious, because I hear this from people who defend Pelosi to me and say, "You know what? If Democrats ran the amount of ads that Republicans ran against Pelosi, if they ran those same number of ads against Mitch McConnell, he'd be a pariah, too." Why don't you go after Republican leaders, the way Republicans go after Democratic leaders?

SEN. DICK DURBIN:

I don't think it's a message that really carries the day. Voters are listening for both political parties to say something other than a political squabble is underway in Washington. They're looking for us to address the issues that affect them and their future: the cost of prescription drugs, whether they've saved enough money for retirement, making sure that health insurance is available and affordable. These are things that drive the message home. The Republicans can't win on those issues. So they get personal.

CHUCK TODD:

I've talked to a lot of Democratic activists this week in Nevada and Arizona, a lot of Democratic strategists. And a lot of them complained, off the record, about how Senate Democrats handled the Kavanaugh situation. And they're upset, because it impacted those races. Both races have changed post-Kavanaugh. What would you have done differently, if you could do it again?

SEN. DICK DURBIN:

Chuck, that's a good question but a tough one to answer. We were dealt cards, in the Senate Judiciary Committee, we never anticipated. The fact that there'd be a letter coming forward from Dr. Ford, which eventually became public, which led to a hearing, which we had not even planned. All of those things were unforeseen. This was not some strategy that was laid out. It unfolded this way. We did the best we could under the circumstances. I still believe that we did the right thing in voting against Brett Kavanaugh for the Supreme Court.

CHUCK TODD:

All right. I want to move to the issue of now confirmed dead journalist, Jamal Khashoggi. The Saudi government, after 17 days, now confirming that, yes, he died at the hands of some Saudi intelligence agents. I've got to put up the changing story from them. It's amazing. It took them -- for ten days, they were saying things like, "We're investigating. They're looking. He left the consulate." That was one of their first explanations, saying, "this idea that Saudi Arabia was responsible, that was baseless and false". Then last week, they started working on a cover story. President Trump suggested rogue killers were to blame. And then finally, they claim it was, essentially, an accidental death as a result of some sort of brawl. Is there any part of this story that you accept as credible from the Saudi Arabian government?

SEN. DICK DURBIN:

No, and as a matter of fact, the only person on earth outside of the Saudi kingdom who appears to accept it is President Donald Trump. Here's what we ought to do, and we ought to do it tomorrow morning, we ought to expel -- formerly expel the Saudi Ambassador from the United States until there is a completion of a third party investigation into this kidnap, murder, and god knows what followed that occurred in Istanbul. We should call on our allies to do the same. Unless the Saudi kingdom understands that civilized countries around the world are going to reject this conduct and make sure that they pay a price for it, they'll continue doing it. They have a fellow named Raif Badawi, a journalist who's currently in prison for criticizing the Saudi regime. There is another man Waleed al-Khair who is also facing imprisonment and torture, if necessary, by them, unless he changes his criticism of the regime. If we want them to stop this and make it clear we don't accept it, we need to be decisive. Expel that journalist. Stop our assistance to their war in Yemen. Let them know they are going to pay a price.

CHUCK TODD:

Do you believe the crown price was -- ordered this killing? Senator Corker, this morning, says he believes that the crown prince himself ordered this.

SEN. DICK DURBIN:

I believe it. Five of his top personal bodyguards are those -- among those accused in the eighteen. His personal bodyguards and one of them has said, publicly a year ago, I don't move without an order from the executive. The crown prince has his fingerprints all over this and the fact that he is heading up the investigation makes it totally incredible.

CHUCK TODD:

All right. Senator Dick Durbin, I'm going to leave it there. Senator, I appreciate your time and for coming on and sharing your views. Much appreciated.

SEN. DICK DURBIN:

Thanks, Chuck.

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