MSNBC "All in with Chris Hayes" - Transcript: Interview with Rep. Ted Lieu

Interview

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MELBER: Well, certainly it`s hypocritical but it`s no different from the  original stated reason for removing Director Comey which is that he was  unfair to Hillary Clinton. Convenience seems to Trump consistency over  there I think it`s fair to observe. My thanks to Matt and Gabe. I now  turn as promised to Congressman Ted Lieu. The House Committees are already  responding to this report. What do you think is significant here?

REP. TED LIEU (D), CALIFORNIA: Well, I don`t think a lot is significant  because in terms of the 25th Amendment, people have been talking about that  and the White House for a long time. Omarosa she said was so routine they  had a hashtag for it TFA. So what`s alarming would be people who didn`t  think about the 25th Amendment. Anyone watching this would have thought  about that. And none of this appeared have been executed. He didn`t seem  to have taped anything. He didn`t seem to have gone much further with 25th  Amendment talks so this would not be enough to fire Rod Rosenstein and if  he did, it would be obstruction of justice.

MELBER: Yes, and with your blessing, Congressman, I would like to get  really nerdy here and talk about a concept in government that is "pre- decisional." You`re familiar with that concept in the FOIA context when  you have a Freedom of Information request that there is a space in  government to talk about things pre-decision before a decision is made.  And it seems that we are in the heart of that at DOJ during what is an  incredible time brought upon by Donald Trump`s actions where there was a  range of discussions going on. I thought it was notable that Mike Schmidt  who`s done this reporting didn`t think the wiretap got anywhere. And so  whatever it was, it wasn`t a thing.

LIEU: That`s a great point. So the reason that the public can`t get  documents or pre-decisional under FOIA, these laws of transparency, it`s  because we want people to be able to put out ideas that may not be good  ideas or they want to take back or they`re just floating it out there, and  that`s why I don`t think this is enough to fire Rod Rosenstein and the  president did it. It really would be a pretext to try to get a Mueller  investigation. It`s also really suspicious the timing of all of this. You  just have Paul Manafort flip, you have Michael Cohen his longtime lawyer  flip, and then we see these sources talking about what Rod Rosenstein did.

MELBER: Well, and that goes to what Michael Schmitt I think was defending  and I think viewers can take this on for themselves and think about it both  ways. And the other -- on the one hand they may have spent a long time  reporting this out and some of this may have just come together. On the  other hand, right, so the Times may feel they`ve been working the story.  Some of it may have just come together because there may be people right  now for a range of reasons who are going hard at Rod Rosenstein. I mean,  it`s quite noticeable and quite blatant when this is happening.

LIEU: That`s absolutely correct. And even some of the sources as you had  pointed out we`re not in the room so it`s hard to know if someone is being  sarcastic or not if you`re not listening to that statement firsthand and I  think you have other reporting now, one from Washington Post that does  suggest that maybe Rob Rosenstein was being sarcastic. But in another day,  none of these things that he used about or thought about where actually  ever implemented and it could simply turn out that he thought about it, then he had these interactions with the president, and he cited no I think the best thing is not to do a 25th amendment and as he says in his own statement, he doesn`t believe there`s any basis for it.

MELBER: Right. Well, it`s certainly an unusual story when and why is what  we`re exploring. Congressman Ted Lieu, thanks for spending some time with  us tonight.

LIEU: Thank you, Ari.

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