MSNBC "The Rachel Maddow Show" - Transcript: Interview with Rep. Jerrold Nadler

Interview

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MADDOW: Yet.

That was the voice of Congressman Jerry Nadler of New York, who is the top  Democrat on the judiciary committee in the House which hosted this mammoth  hearing today. Congressman Nadler reminding everybody at today`s hearing  with that "yet" that special counsel Robert Mueller is still working.  There may yet be more indictments.

That moment came after Congressman Nadler`s colleague, Elijah Cummings,  reminded everybody visually of the work that Robert Mueller has already  done when he had his staff hold up giant more than life sized photos of all  the Trump administration and Trump campaign connected people hope have  already pled guilty in the special counsel`s investigation.

So, that`s what Ricky Pineda (ph) looks like.

Today`s hearing ended barely an hour ago, ten hours after it started. The  top Democrat in the room, Congressman Nadler, spent much of this long day  honestly trying to get the Republicans on the committee to abide by their  own rules and to let Strzok get his answers out. At one point, Congressman  Nadler actually tried to get the whole thing adjourned after Republicans  threatened to hold Peter Strzok in contempt over his very first answer  today.

Congressman Nadler joins us now.

Congressman, thank you very much for being with us. It`s a pleasure to  have you here. You must be tired.

NADLER: Pleasure to be here.

MADDOW: What is your bottom line take away from today`s hearing? I was  struck by your opening statement in which one of your closing lines was,  leave the special counsel alone. You were critical of this hearing today,  critical of Republicans` intentions behind bringing this witness out in the  way they did.

How do you think it went?

NADLER: Well, I think it went very well. I mean, this whole hearing and  the hearing with Deputy Attorney General Rosenstein a couple weeks ago,  they`re shows. They`re shows intended to help Donald Trump as the walls  seem to be closing in on him. They`re intended to use people who turned  out to be fairly minor characters, Strzok and Page, in the investigation  because remember, Strzok was let go from the investigation as soon as --  just about as soon as Mueller came in.

And they`re trying to show that because he was clearly, his personal  political opinion and his girlfriend Page were very anti-Trump. This  somehow biased his decisions and therefore, biased the investigation  whereas the inspector general found there was no evidence in any bias in  any of the decisions and his answer that he and others -- a lot of people  participated in all those decisions.

All of this was intended to throw mud to undermine the integrity of the  investigation and to undermine its integrity and its credibility. And, of  course, it`s headed by demanding that he answer questions and a few weeks  ago, Deputy Attorney General Rosenstein answered questions that they cannot  answer -- questions that go to the heart of an ongoing criminal  investigation which they may not answer according to long-standing  department of justice policy. It puts him in a position where if he answers the question he`s violating the proper policy not to interfere with an investigation. If he doesn`t, he risks contempt of Congress which 
they`re deliberately threatening.

And they`re trying to do all this to distract from the investigation and to  poison the jury pool as Mayor Giuliani said. All of this is propaganda to  undermine the credibility of the investigation so whenever it comes out  with a report, people won`t believe it. But the facts are clear. Several  facts.

One, in a year -- little over a year, they have -- the investigation has  resulted in 20 indictments, many of them of people close to the Trump  campaign or administration. Five guilty pleas, also of people close to the  Trump administration, high up in the campaign.

And we know that the best evidence that the investigation is not a witch  hunt and is in fact being fairly conducted is there have been no leaks.  There`s been a one-sided propaganda campaign by the president, as a witch  hunt by his Republican henchmen in Congress to try to discredit the  investigation. But there have been no leaks.

All we really know, and they haven`t answered the accusations. All we  really know about the investigation are what the charging documents and  indictments say, what the guilty pleas say and what various court filings  say, period. It`s remarkable there have been no leaks. And that tells me  that the investigation is being fairly conduct and the fact that there have  been so many indictments and guilty pleas in only a year and a year and a  quarter, is remarkable for an investigation of this breadth.

When I compare it to the two and a half year Benghazi investigation chaired  by Mr. Gowdy, for example, it is remarkable.

And one other thing -- you looked at the hearing today and half the  Republicans would not permit the witness to answer questions. They just  cast aspersions on his character. They made speeches. They kept coming  back to the same expressions of political opinion in his texts to his  girlfriend.

But again, the inspector general found that there was no evidence  whatsoever that their political opinions influenced the decisions in the  investigation in any way and again, remember, that Mr. Strzok was removed  from the investigation very early on, not because he did anything terribly  wrong, but because I assume because Mueller, Mr. Mueller being wise in the  ways of Washington knew that his investigation if it went anywhere would be  subject to unfair accusations and besmirching and wanted to remove a  possible target and he did. But they`re using that anyway.

MADDOW: One of the controversies that arose during the hearing today was  whether or not the previous testimony by Mr. Strzok, he testified behind  closes doors for 11 hours not long ago, not that many days ago. There was  some discussion among members of your -- members from your side of the  aisle today maybe the transcript from that 11 hours of testimony should be  released, as well, even a suggestion that the Democrats might release it  over the objections of the Republicans.

Is that likely to happen?

NADLER: Well, Chairman Cummings -- ranking member Cummings of the  Oversight Investigations Committee and I sent a letter to Gowdy and -- to Chairman Gowdy and Chairman Goodlatte a number of days ago requesting precisely. We`ve been demanding that.

Now, there has to be some scrubbing of personal information. But  basically, those transcripts should be made public and the fact that  Goodlatte and Gowdy have refused to make it public tells me that they know  that that would detract from all the accusations they`re making because he  handled himself as well in that 11-hour interrogation as did he in today`s  ten-hour interrogation.

MADDOW: Yes, today was a reminder that one of the -- one of the  underappreciated qualities you need in public service is stamina.  Congressman Jerrold Nadler, that top Democrat on the Judiciary Committee,  this was a very, very long day and a fascinating one. Thank you for your  time tonight sir. Much appreciated.

NADLER: Thank you.

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