CNN "Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees" - Transcript: Interview with Senator Jeff Merkley

Interview

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COOPER: Kaitlan Collins, thanks very much, from the White House.

Oregon Democratic Senator Jeff Merkley serves on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee and recently toured immigration detention centers on the South Texas border. He joins us now.

Senator, thanks for being with us.

So, according to House members in this meeting with the president tonight, the president thinks that the images of these children in detention centers are bad, but the fact is, I mean, he does have the power to change this policy. Why do you think he refuses to at least acknowledge that he has that power?

SEN. JEFF MERKLEY (D), OREGON: Well, former presidents when they established a policy, they feel like they have to take responsibility for it, the buck stops here, good or bad, they're going to explain their decision. If they feel they've made a mistake, maybe they will change it.

In this case, we have a president who is just psychologically incapable of taking responsibility for what he's done.

COOPER: Do you have a sense tonight if we're any closer to a resolution if there's problem? Because another day that goes by obviously without a solution is another day that these kids continue to be separated from their parents and potentially more kids are.

MERKLEY: Yes, I'm very concerned that we're going to end up in the quicksand of the legislative process and just be stuck. Maybe tar sands is a better way to put it. And that's why we want to keep the president in the middle of this.

He caused this with a stroke of his pen. He can end it with a stroke of his pen. And things are not getting better.

I mean, when we heard the homeland security secretary essentially be offended that people would say, well, this was about deterrence or a legislative leverage, then what does the president do? He comes to the Capitol Hill just a couple hours ago and basically frames us his legislative leverage for his wish list of poorly thought through, egregious immigration, and I can't even call them reforms, changes. And so, he's doing exactly what we hurting children to create legislative leverage, that's just come -- it's evil.

COOPER: So, when the president says this is about Democratic structure obstructionism, what do you say?

MERKLEY: Well, I would say no Democrat held the pen that created this policy and no Democrat can hold the pen that can end it. That is a presidential pen.

COOPER: Majority Leader Mitch McConnell said today that there's unanimity within the Republican conference that they want to fix this. Do you take -- do you take him at his word or are you and your fellow Democrats willing to work with them to try to do that? And in a comprehensive way that goes beyond just this particular issue? Or do you want to just focus on this particular issue, the separation?

MERKLEY: Well, when he would had his stake out today, he said specifically this shouldn't be a broader bill. It should just be this issue, which I was heartened by.

And then I heard he was leaning towards the Ted Cruz bill and the Ted Cruz bill is basically about, A, walking the children up along with the parents so instead of handcuffs for the parents, it's handcuffs for all. And then second of all, having just two weeks for an asylum hearing which means that it's a kangaroo court because there's no way an immigrant can get the documentation from their home country and prepare to consult with an attorney and present a case for asylum in that short period of time.

So, I'm very concerned that Mitch McConnell's strategy of a narrow bill is a strategy that actually does further harm.

COOPER: What do you say to the president and his supporters and other Republicans who say look in past, the policy that the U.S. has had hasn't work, that many people are -- that they're basically released with their kids, they disappeared into the United States and, you know, 75 percent may come back and appear in court like they're supposed tom but that means 25 percent don't?

MERKLEY: Well, so, there was a case management program enacted or put together to improve on this.

[20:15:03] The only reporter I've seen on it so far says they had a 99 percent response rate. That is people showing up for their hearings. It costs far much less money than in imprisoning people. And a 99 percent rate is a pretty good rate.

Now, I haven't seen an independent assessment that's accurate, but the idea of having a case manager who tracks where people are make sure they turn out and keeps the families together so that essentially we're not inflicting harm on them makes a lot of sense. Let's learn -- that's a program that the president ended a year ago June.

Let's -- why did he end it? It sounds like it was working.

COOPER: And just lastly, I want to play something that the president said about Democratic support for immigration reform today, and I just want to play this now.

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COOPER: I just want to give you a chance to respond to that. Do you view MS-13 members coming in the country as potential voters?

MERKLEY: You know, it's so disheartening here the president casts this type of aspersions. In 2013, we had a bipartisan bill, a lot of security at the border. There's a tremendous amount of security. It was added during the Obama years, people working together not just for the border but to address the issue of people overstaying visas.

And so, the president because he can't take responsibility for his policy and he can't argue the logic of it because he argued deterrence and that's -- hurting kids for deterrence is wrong, even his secretary of homeland security said that that doesn't fly and yet that was the heart of this decision. So, he just decides to cast insults against people.

So, it's -- I guess the word that comes to my mind is it's pathetic, that the president is incapable of -- as an adult taking responsibility, having an honest conversation about the things that worked in the past that he eliminated and about the impact of this policy on children, and for that matter on children and parents.

I know he wants to cast this as closed borders versus open borders. That is completely a thousand percent fallacious. This is about people showing up, but show up being treated well for their asylum here and recognizing that four out of five aren't going to be granted asylum and they're going to be deported based on past statistics. But you don't do harm to people fleeing persecution from overseas and seeking a hearing in the United States of America.

COOPER: Senator Merkley, I appreciate your time. Thank you very much.

MERKLEY: Thank you.

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