CNN "The Situation Room" - Transcript: Interview With Congressman Ted Lieu

Interview

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KEILAR: All right, Evan Perez, thank you so much. Great report.

And joining me now is Congressman Ted Lieu. He's a Democrat who serves on the Judiciary and the Foreign Affairs Committees.

Congressman, thank you so much for being with us today.

And, as you know, the policy right now that the Department of Justice has, it says that a sitting president cannot be indicted. Does Rudy Giuliani just -- is he just sort of speaking the truth here when he says that, ultimately, this does come down to Congress and the American public? Because this really may not be an issue of a sitting president being indicted. It's impeachment, right?

REP. TED LIEU (D), CALIFORNIA: Well, thank you, Brianna, for that question.

I'm a former prosecutor. And I know that when the defense team doesn't have a good argument, what they do is put the police on trial. They attack law enforcement. That's what we're seeing right now, because the defense team for President Trump really does not have a good argument.

And they're scared of what the report from Robert Mueller is going to show. By the way, former White House counsel, two of them, wrote an op-ed recently, saying that the president, in fact, can be indicted. So, I think that's an open question, still. KEILAR: But, as a former prosecutor, you know that it sometimes works

when the defense takes on the police. You know that that can be effective.

LIEU: It can be. That's why the defense counsel will do that sometimes, when they don't have the evidence.

But, in this case, I do trust the American people to see what the actual evidence is and to see what the crimes are, if any, that were committed. We already know that there were five guilty pleas, so people have committed crimes already. Now we're going to see how high up the Trump campaign did these crimes go.

KEILAR: Robert Mueller could actually ask the deputy attorney general, Rod Rosenstein, for an exemption from that policy if he believes that the circumstances are extraordinary here.

Do you see any situation where that could happen?

LIEU: We would have to see what the evidence is that Robert Mueller uncovered, but we know from public reporting that the special counsel has access to a lot of information.

They have tapes from Spanish -- the country of Spain, when they were recording interviews that had to do with Donald Trump Jr. So, there's just a lot of information the special counsel has, and we will see what that's going to produce when the counsel produces that report.

KEILAR: I want to -- I do want to be clear. CNN has not confirmed that report, just to put that out there. We have been looking into that. We have not confirmed it.

Do you think that the special counsel should be looking for a way to challenge that policy that a sitting president cannot be indicted?

LIEU: I think the special counsel should look at the U.S. Constitution. There's nothing in our Constitution that says a president cannot be indicted.

But let's just take a step back. Why are we even talking about this? This is pretty amazing stuff, right? We're talking about impeachment, about indictment. So why don't we wait to see what the report is that special counsel Mueller puts out and what he actually does? And I think it's best that we wait to see what the actual evidence is.

[18:10:07]

KEILAR: I want to turn now to North Korea.

It's looking like the summit between the president and Kim Jong-un may be back on track. Do you expect it to happen? Are you optimistic that anything can be achieved here?

LIEU: I hope it happens.

I formerly served on active duty under U.S. Pacific Command. It's very clear the United States has exactly zero good military options against the North Korean regime. That's why diplomacy must always be our first option. I'm glad it's taking center stage. And I hope it happens.

I don't think June 12 is any sort of magical date. It will be great if it happens on that date. But if it's pushed back a little bit later, that will be fine as well.

KEILAR: Is there any reason to believe that things are different this time around when it comes to North Korea? There have been so many false starts in recent years.

LIEU: There have been. And if you look at North Korea, they have had periods where they will open up and interact with democracies and then they will pull back. They will say one thing, they will do another. They will lie. They will take actions that are inconsistent.

But at least, if we can start the diplomacy and we can start on a path to denuclearization, then we should at least give that a try. And maybe we will have something different, because we do have a new North Korean leader that's different, perhaps, than his predecessors.

KEILAR: When you see summits like this or slightly even akin to this, the process is different, right? You normally see a lot of work on the front end, lower level, hashing out details.

And then when you see leaders meet, they tend to be blessing an agreement that has happened, right?

That's not what's happening here. This is -- this is leaders who are meeting. They may not achieve a lot. It sounds like the expectations are awfully low and that this may just be a moment for them to, in a way, show some sort of commitment to doing something. Is that problematic?

LIEU: That is a good point.

And it does feel somewhat rushed, what's happening right now, trying to make this June 12 date. And, again, to me, that's not a magical date. If they need more time, I think they should push it off if they need more time.

But I do think having the president and North Korean leader sit down together is a good thing. You have to start somewhere. And if you want to have a denuclearization deal, that's going to take a long time. There's a lot of steps. And it's a whole process.

But you have to begin it at some point. I think a summit would be a good place to start beginning those discussions.

KEILAR: So you're OK with there being no preconditions laid out for the summit?

LIEU: Absolutely.

I just want this summit to happen, because I want negotiations and dialogue and diplomacy. We need to at least try that first before we contemplate any sort of military conflict against a regime for which we have no good military options.

KEILAR: So, you mentioned, you were active duty. You were an Air Force officer. You're actually a colonel in the Air Force Reserves, as I understand it, right now.

And this is an important day today, on Memorial Day, and we thank you for being with us on this day, sir.

I know you spoke this morning. We were talking off-camera and you said that you spoke at the Los Angeles Memorial Cemetery. You actually spoke about World War I and some of the contributions that women made in World War I, which a lot of people might not be aware of.

As you're experiencing this day, you know, what's on your mind as a veteran?

LIEU: Thank you, Brianna, for raising that issue.

Today, we honor those brave men and women who served our military and gave their lives in service of America.

And I'm glad you mentioned World War I. It is the centennial. The armistice was signed on the 11th hour of the 11th day of the 11th month in 1918. And we honor the sacrifices that Americans made. Over 100,000 died. Over 200,000 were wounded. And it was also the first conflict in which -- actually, the first ever where U.S. women joined the U.S. military, and they were 13,000 who enlisted in the U.S. Navy at the time.

KEILAR: There's -- a lot of people spend this day, you know, certainly enjoying a long weekend, but it's really -- it's about so much more.

I know that that's something that you understand well, having served in the military. As you reflect on this day, you know, what's been on your mind?

LIEU: So, one thing on my mind is that we need to understand that all members of the military have to do one thing before they can enter service, to take an oath to the United States Constitution.

And, at the end of the day, that's what we're honoring. The people who made their sacrifices made their sacrifices to defend our Constitution. And today is not just important for those who are fallen, but also for the principles that Americans stand for.

KEILAR: All right, Congressman Ted Lieu, we appreciate you joining us from Southern California. Thank you.

[18:15:01]

LIEU: Thank you, Brianna.

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