MSNBC "All in with Chris Hayes" - Transcript: Russian Investigations

Interview

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HAYES: Congresswoman Maxine Waters, a Democrat of California joins me here tonight in New York City. It`s nice to have you here in studio.

REP. MAXINE WATERS (D), CALIFORNIA: Good to be here.

HAYES: What is your read of the message the President is or is not sending to Michael Cohen?

WATERS: Well, it`s quite obvious that he is sending a message that he will pardon him. I understand that he treated him very badly. He had no respect for him and despite the fact that Cohen has said he would take a bullet, I don`t think so. I don`t think he`ll take prison. And so when people talk about him flipping, I think it just drives the President crazy. And he is sending him a message surely that don`t worry, I`m going take care of you. And he`s demonstrated that he will pardon. Now what he has done? He pardoned at least two people, Arpaio and Scooter Libby. And so yes, it`s quite clear to me and I think to anybody watching that that`s what he is trying the do.

HAYES: So you think this is -- this is a part of what I think people like yourself and others argue as a sort of on-going slow motion obstruction effort by the President?

WATERS: Absolutely. He`s obstructing justice right before our very eyes. And he does not stop. He continues to, you know, use the powers of the president to send a message to those who would flip on him or who would cooperate with the investigation that he`ll take care of them and he`s done it consistently.

HAYES: You know, there`s -- a lot of people have made the point recently that ultimately, the Attorney General Jeff Sessions who has recused himself from the Russia investigation and Rod Rosenstein`s overseeing that, that he has to be praised for essentially defending the independence of the Department of Justice and protecting that investigation. There`s reporting saying that he told the White House last week that if Rosenstein were fired, he may have to go as well. You`re someone very critical of the Attorney General. What do you think of that piece?

WATERS: As you know, he did recuse himself, as you just said, and the President has not been kind to him, despite the fact he was an early supporter of the President, endorsed him when nobody else would, the President said he wanted to fire him at one point. And so now that he`s refused to leave and he is taking up for Rod Rosenstein, I`m surprised. I`m surprised and I certainly didn`t expect very much of him and I don`t know why he didn`t leave after the President humiliated him so. And so I don`t know what`s going on.

HAYES: Do you derive pleasure from his humiliation given how low your opinions is of him?

WATERS: I`m always surprised when individuals take that kind of beating. I`m surprised that they don`t stand up for themselves, that they don`t feel as if they have been undermined and humiliated to the point where they don`t want to serve. I don`t know why he wanted to stay.

HAYES: You`ve also have very strong criticism of James Comey, the former FBI Director. I want to play this clip.

WATERS: I know.

HAYES: It`s a notorious clip. Well, you know, it made an impression. Take a listen to this.

WATERS: OK, all right.

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WATERS: Yes.

HAYES: That was during a transition. It was a briefing that Director Comey gave to Members of Congress which was classified which I guess you cannot speak about still.

WATERS: That`s right.

HAYES: But you and Donald Trump do agree on that. That sentence you said, the FBI Director has no credibility. You and Donald Trump were agreeing on that.

WATERS: No, absolutely not. I tried to clarify that and to say yes, coming out of that classified briefing, I said that, and I certainly meant it. However, I think it is quite different when you take a look at Comey and his relationship to the President what he said, what he`s done, I believe him.

HAYES: You believe him?

WATERS: I believe him, yes. And so then was then and now is now.

HAYES: The White House keeps saying now, and I want to -- they have a new talking point about the firing of Rosenstein or Mueller which seemed very close and then seemed to diffuse a little bit recently. Here`s what they`re saying. I`m going to play you a few short clips of White House spokespeople saying they don`t have any intention to fire Mueller. Take a listen.

WATERS: Yes, yes, yes.

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HAYES: Do you believe them?

WATERS: No, I don`t believe them. And let me tell you, he would fire them in the hot second if he didn`t think he would get the kind of pushback that he`s been warned about. You have Senators on both sides of the aisle saying you better not, you better not do this. And I think that he is not prepared to cross them at this time because he does not know what will happen. Perhaps they`ll join me, they want to impeach him.

HAYES: Are you -- are you -- the belief that Democrats should make impeachment a centerpiece of the midterm elections?

WATER: Well, they have indicate they`d do not want to do that. They think that the Republicans --

HAYES: Who`s the "they"? Who`s the "they"?

WATERS: The leadership. You know, whether we`re talking about the DNC or the DCCC, they all believe that the Republicans will just use that and say they`re mad because they lost the election, and they don`t particularly think that that`s good way to go with this. I don`t agree with him.

HAYES: You don`t agree.

WATERS: No.

HAYES: You don`t agree both tactically and also substantively. I mean, I guess my point is I know that you substantively feel he has committed impeachable offenses.

WATERS: That`s right. That`s right.

HAYES: Are you not persuaded by the idea that it would be a tactical mistake politically?

WATERS: No, I`m not persuaded by that idea. You know why? Because I tell you everywhere I go, people are talking about why can`t you all get rid of him?

HAYES: Right.

WATERS: Why don`t they impeach him? What`s wrong with the other Members of Congress, why don`t they stand up with you? This man is dishonorable. He lies all the time. He`s a con man. They say all of these things and I`m not just talking about my district, whether I`m on the airplane, I`m walking down the street in New York, wherever I am, I`m hearing it and I`m told that 70 percent of women who have been polled say that they want him up peached.

HAYES: All right, Congresswoman Maxine Waters, thank you very much.

WATERS: You`re welcome.

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