MSNBC "All in with Chris Hayes" - Transcript: Russian Investigations

Interview

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HAYES: Big crowds. The President did not answer that question but according to the reports, his allies are increasingly worried Cohen will flip on his long-time boss, the President of the United States. Pretty telling that just about everyone in the President's inner circle on and off the record seems to believe there's some kind of criminal conduct for Cohen to spill about. Democratic Senator Richard Blumenthal is a member of the Senate Judiciary Committee. Have you noticed that too that when people talking about Michael Cohen and the President there's this question of will he flip? There's very little of, well, there's nothing to flip on.

SEN. RICHARD BLUMENTHAL, (D-CT), SENATE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE: Well, I can tell you as a former Prosecutor, I've seen a lot of potential witnesses say they are going to be completely loyal, that they know nothing and Michael Cohen may be saying that now, and the President's Allies may be hoping or counting on him standing firm. But there is nobody who knows more about Donald Trump than Michael Cohen. And he has the means and motive and opportunity to cooperate.

HAYES: There are a lot of people -- one thing the White House has done quite effectively is they basically kind of put out this idea that there's a Russia investigation, and if there's, "no collusion," which obviously the White House insists there isn't, that anything else that happens that gets investigated outside of this sort of narrow question of did the President and Vladimir Putin, you know, talk to each other or something, isn't legitimate, what do you what's your response to that?

BLUMENTHAL: The scope of the Mueller investigation is very, very broad. It is appropriately and necessarily broad because what the Special Counsel is investigating is not only potential collusion between the Russians and the Trump campaign but also obstruction of justice. In other words, interference, and intimidation in that investigation and there are potential links if Michael Cohen is convicted and he faces very serious potential charges of money laundering and wire fraud. And the information that he has could be extremely incriminating to the President of the United States.

HAYES: There is a Bloomberg story today that said that Rod Rosenstein, who is the number two at justice under Jeff Sessions, a person who is Running the -- sort of supervising the Mueller investigation which Session were accused, told Trump that Trump is not a target in the Mueller or Cohen probes, response to that.

BLUMENTHAL: Again, as a former Prosecutor, to be a subject or a target, the line is very thin. Right now Donald Trump is a subject. But that line is readily and swiftly often crossed in these investigations.

HAYES: There is news today that Rudy Giuliani will be joining the President's legal team, and he says he's joining the legal team to negotiate an end to this. What does that mean to you?

BLUMENTHAL: The most significant thing that Rudy Giuliani said is that he thinks that the Special Prosecutor should be permitted to conclude his investigation. Rudy Giuliani is a big name with star power. But what the President needs is a serious litigator with brainpower. And Rudy Giuliani could provide it if he does and the President listens. And if he does, what he will tell the President of the United States is, cooperate truly with this investigation, commit that it will be concluded without your interference or firing Robert Mueller, and support the legislation that's now pending and I'm one of the drafters and sponsors of it that would protect the Special Counsel and make sure that a court would view any interference by firing in that investigation.

HAYES: On that legislation, Chuck Grassley said he's going to bring it to committee vote, right? Is that going to happen?

BLUMENTHAL: It will happen next week -- next week.

HAYES: Next week. Mitch McConnell says it's not coming to the floor. So then what happens?

BLUMENTHAL I think Mitch McConnell is going to face a groundswell within his own caucus.

HAYES: You really think so?

BLUMENTHAL: I think if there are Continuing threats and rants and tirades from the President, in other words, if he fails to follow what I hope will be Rudy Giuliani's advice, that he should state unequivocally and publicly that he will permit this investigation to finish. I think there will be that ground as well. You know, there is a growing sense of real alarm among Republican colleagues. Democracy is not shatter-proof, and our democracy is under attack. Time is not on our side. The time for wishful thinking --and I think Mitch McConnell has expressed his wishful thinking that we have nothing to worry about. That time is over. And I think it may not be next week, but at some point, if Donald Trump continues these threats and the danger to our democracy continues as well, I think you will see a groundswell within that caucus.

HAYES: And finally what do you say to people that say you are putting more faith in your colleagues' good faith than maybe has been demonstrating publicly thus far?

BLUMENTHAL: I have to put good faith in my colleagues because it's the way we --

HAYES: You work there every day?

BLUMENTHAL: I work there every day. I work with them every day and I hope that they will do the right thing. This legislation --

HAYES: Hope is not a plan, Senator.

BLUMENTHAL: This legislation is bipartisan, but let me just be very clear. Ultimately my colleagues can count and what will really count is the American people. They have to rise up. They have to express to my colleagues that kind of pressure.

HAYES: Senator Richard Blumenthal, it's always a pleasure to have you here in studio. Thank you very much.

BLUMENTHAL: Thank you.

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