CNN Lou Dobbs Tonight - Transcript
CNN Lou Dobbs Tonight - Transcript
Thursday, July 28, 2005
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DOBBS: More now on the passage of the Central American Free Trade Agreement in the middle of the night. My guests tonight on opposite sides of that debate, Democratic Congresswoman Marcy Kaptur of Ohio voted against it.
Republican Congressman Senator Kevin Brady of Texas enthusiastically voted for it. In fact, Congressman Brady said yesterday -- quote -- "this agreement will create American jobs, lower the trade deficit, help us win the textile war against China and provide security and stability in our hemisphere," end quote.
Congresswoman Kaptur, how in the world could you vote against what appears to be a panacea to nearly every trade and security issue?
REP. MARCY KAPTUR, (D) OHIO: Well, thanks for asking, Lou. The bill passed by the slimmest of margins -- two votes. And we know that CAFTA basically expands NAFTA which has cost us a million jobs in this country already. They promised it would create jobs. They promised it would create trade surpluses. It's actually created trade deficits.
And what's been happening is where they were talking about PNTR with China or NAFTA, these agreements never work out the way that the proponents claim. We have plenty of evidence of that. And last night, the clock was kept open last night for well over an hour. This did not pass out of conviction, this passed out of pure politics on the floor where people's chairmanships were threatened, where they were offered projects. We've seen this happen before. And it really wasn't a vote of principle by many.
DOBBS: Congressman Brady, I mean, Congresswoman Kaptur has described this -- leaves us rather skeptical here. Because U.S. Trade Representative Portman said that this was passed purely on the basis of it being a sound agreement which was taken to the bosom of our representatives in the House. Is that actually correct?
REP. KEVIN BRADY, (R) TEXAS: Well, yes, it is. And I'll tell you what, this was a very healthy debate. Trade is an important issue. We all come down on different sides of it. I respect Marcy. I disagree. And I think some accusations, you know, when you lose, you know, it's painful. But no one likes a sore loser. Not that Marcy is, but as far as the issue is.
The fact of the matter is, it has passed. We are going to stay engaged in Central America. We're going to build those bridges, not build walls. And now really the question is, can we work together as both parties to try to both move them forward and create more job opportunities for our workers. I think there's some common ground.
DOBBS: All right. Congressman Brady, I think that's a gracious way to put it.
Now, let me just ask you, if I may, because you have put down some rather bold markers here. National security. It's going to create American jobs. It's going to cut the trade deficit. Now, we haven't seen the trade deficit do anything but expand for some years -- each successive year, a new record.
Has anybody told you, Congressman -- I should tell you, at the outset, the Treasury secretary couldn't even begin to imagine what U.S. export would benefit from a lower dollar against the RNB. But I'm going to ask you, did anybody in the administration tell you just how much lower the trade deficit would be? Precisely how many American jobs net would be created? And assure you absolutely that no American jobs would be lost?
BRADY: One, I don't think any day of the year you can predict what jobs will be won or lost. What I know is that the Independent International Trade Commission reported that because Central America already sells into America, and has for 20 years, that we have great economic benefits. And that we'll create, well, from a trade deficit standpoint, will improve our position by about $700 million.
Now admittedly, that's not a lot. But that's in the right direction. And an important point is, about 80 percent of our trade deficit is with nations we don't have trade agreements with. When we have a level playing field, we sell more and more into those countries. That's what this was about.
DOBBS: Have we got a trade agreement with Europe? BRADY: No.
DOBBS: With China?
BRADY: No.
DOBBS: Well, can I ask you a question?
BRADY: Yes, sir.
DOBBS: Why wouldn't this administration start working on it with China, where we've got a $162 billion trade deficit last year, expected to go well over $170 billion this year, open up markets in Europe, or Japan. Why wouldn't that be the focus? This seems sort of a peculiar thing.
BRADY: No, actually, if you look at our strategy of opening new markets for American producers, we are doing both one-on-one, bilateral type arrangements. We're doing regional arrangements like this. And then at the World Trade Organization level, we're trying to create level playing fields around the globe.
It's hard work to do it, because a lot of countries like to sell into America, but they're reluctant to open their markets. That's what our goal is.
DOBBS: Congresswoman Kaptur, you're going to get the last word. What do you think will be the impact and what do you think will be the result?
KAPTUR: I think America will lose more jobs as a result of this agreement. Our trade deficit will continue to escalate, until we have two-way trade and a principle of free trade among free people.
None of these agreements do that. They basically advantage the very large multinational corporations. They don't take people into consideration. And so, the people of our country get disenfranchised, the middle class shrinks, and in these other countries, where liberty is just a distant dream, they don't have a chance of moving into the middle class, so we don't get the real development of an internal consumer market. They can't buy our goods to the extent that my dear colleague here, Mr. Brady, states.
So if you look at China, we have a trade deficit, Japan, Mexico, Canada, Latin America, and the ink just gets deeper, and America becomes less independent as a country.
DOBBS: Congressman Brady, Congressman Kaptur, we thank you very much, both of you, for being here.
BRADY: Thank you.
KAPTUR: Thank you.
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