NBC News " Meet The Press" - Transcript: Sanders on Hillary Clinton And National Security
Interview
CHUCK TODD:
And the Democratic Presidential candidate, Senator Bernie Sanders, joins me now. Senator Sanders, welcome back to Meet the Press. And let me start with an issue you're going to be dealing with in a few hours. I know you're going to be flying back from Minneapolis to Washington for this special Senate session. The NSA, the Patriot Act, section 215, I assume you're in support of the U.S.A. Freedom Act. Are you? Is that where you're going to be voting?
SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS:
I may well be voting for it. It doesn't go as far as I would like it to go. I voted against the original Patriot Act. I voted against reauthorization of the Patriot Act. Look, we have got to be vigorous in fighting terrorism and protecting the American people. But we have to do it in a way that protects the constitutional rights of the American people.
And I'm very, very worried about the invasion of privacy rights that we're seeing not only from the N.S.A. and the government but from corporate America, as well. We're losing our privacy rights. It's a huge issue.
CHUCK TODD:
Well, and the government is going to be asking corporate America to keep this data under the U.S.A. Freedom Act. You're comfortable with that?
SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS:
No, I'm not. But we have to look at the best of bad situations. The question is whether the N.S.A. keeps it, the question is whether it is transferred to the phone companies, who, by the way, already keep records for an extended period of time.
CHUCK TODD:
You've served under two Democratic presidents, in Congress, and the two Democrats are Bill Clinton and Barack Obama. Which one has been a better progressive champion, in your view?
SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS:
Well, neither one of them have gone as far as I would have liked them to go. And that's one of the reasons why we're seeing the disappearance of the middle class in this country and a huge increase in wealth inequality. That is why we are not dealing with the fact that we have 45 million people living in poverty, and why we're still the only major country on Earth that doesn't guarantee health care for all people.
Like, I have a lot of respect for President Obama. I consider him a friend. I disagree with him on issues like the TPP or the extension of tax breaks that Bush initiated. But I think history will judge a President Obama a lot better than many other contemporaries, given the fact that he came into office at a time when this country was in terrible, terrible shape.
CHUCK TODD:
You singled out President Obama for praise but not President Clinton. Why?
SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS:
Well, look, I think Bill Clinton did a very good job, as well. I disagree with him strongly on NAFTA, permanent normal trade relations with China. I'm a strong opponent of these disastrous trade agreements which have cost us millions of decent paying jobs. I'm helping to lead the opposition against the Trans-Pacific Partnership.
I also very strongly disagreed with President Clinton on the deregulation of Wall Street. I opposed that strenuously. And I think the results prove that, when you allow the greed and recklessness of Wall Street to go unchecked, you're going to end up where we are today, and where we were eight years ago.
CHUCK TODD:
You know, it's interesting, when you watch your chief primary opponent right now, Secretary Hillary Clinton, on some key issues, she has changed her position to a more progressive view on same-sex marriage, on immigrantion, over the last ten years, on NAFTA, on trade, on the Iraq War, on Cuba. She has moved from a position, basically, in disagreement with you, to a position that comes closer to your view. So I guess is, do you take her at her word? And do you think that rhetorically, that's enough?
SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS:
Well look, I have known Hillary Clinton for 25 years. I have enormous respect for her, and I like her. And what I hope, Chuck, is that the media will allow us to have a serious debate in this campaign on the enormous issues facing the American people, which is why, for the last 40 years, our middle class has been disappearing, why 99% of all new income generated today is going to the top 1% and why we have this grotesque level of income and wealth inequality.
I have been, I know a lot of people criticize me. In Vermont they say, "Oh Bernie, you've been saying the same thing for 30 years." Well, it's kind of true. And maybe it's a bad ajada . But I have been there. I think we need a political revolution in this country. I think we need to take on the greed of the billionaire class, a disastrous campaign finance system.
CHUCK TODD:
Do you trust these changes that Hillary Clinton has made? Or do you think she's been doing it just for primary politics?
SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS:
I think that's for the American people to decide. I know where I have been on trade agreements. I know where I've been on Wall Street. I know where I've been on the Keystone Pipeline. And Secretary Clinton will obviously explain her position to the American people.
CHUCK TODD:
This week you found out what it's like to become a nationally recognized candidate for potentially, and potentially, a threat to somebody. A leaking of an essay you wrote in the '70s from Alternative Weekly, your campaign described it as satire. I'll be honest with you, Senator Sanders, it's uncomfortable to read. The only excerpt I'm going to put up is, you wrote this in February of '72, was sort of a fantasy of men and women, you said, "A woman enjoys intercourse with her man as she fantasizes being raped by three men simultaneously." Your campaign described it as satire. Can you explain this essay?
SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS:
Sure. Look, this is a piece of fiction that I wrote in 1972, I think. That was 43 years ago. It was very poorly written. And if you read it, what it was dealing with gender stereotypes, why some men like to oppress women, why other women like to be submissive. You know, something like 50 Shades of Gray, very poorly written 43 years ago.
What I'm focusing on right now are the issues impacting the American people today. And that's what I will continue to focus on. And what I think the American people want to hear. And by the way, on broader issues, what I think when we talk about issues, Chuck, we need a lot more debates in this campaign. I hope very much that we can begin with the Democratic candidates at least as early as July, and also Republicans in those debates, as well.
CHUCK TODD:
All right, there you go. Senator Sanders calling for July debates. We will go to secretary Clinton. We're ready to host them right here on Meet the Press. Senator Sanders, stay safe on the trail. We'll see you back in Washington.
SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS:
Thank you.
Source