NBC News " The Rachel Maddow Show" - Transcript: Sanders On Higher Education Funding and 2016 Presidential Elections
Interview
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SANDERS: Not if we have an opportunity to describe what Democratic
socialism means. That means you have countries like Denmark, Sweden,
Norway, other European countries who have social democratic governments and
labor governments.
And the result of that is, in those countries, health care is a right
of all people. I don`t see that as a great problem.
(APPLAUSE)
At a time when so many of our young people can`t afford to go to
college, tuition is free in many of those countries.
(APPLAUSE)
Excellent -- they have excellent child care, strong retirement
benefits, they are often strongly pro-environment, taking on climate
change.
So, I think when people understand that in those countries governments
are working for the middle class rather than the billionaire class, I think
we can get our message across.
MEYERS: I agree. And I --
(APPLAUSE)
And as someone who just came back from Sweden, I can also tell you
they speak Swedish there.
(LAUGHTER)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MADDOW: Joining us now for "The Interview" is that self-proclaimed
Democratic socialist, independent Vermont senator, and Democratic
presidential candidate, Bernie Sanders, who right now is on something of a
roll.
MADDOW: Joining us now for "The Interview" is that self-proclaimed
Democratic socialist, independent Vermont senator, and Democratic
presidential candidate, Bernie Sanders, who right now is on something of a
roll.
Senator, it`s great to see you. Thanks for being here.
SANDERS: Good to be with you, Rachel.
MADDOW: How is it going now versus how you thought it would be going
by now? I will preface this by saying it seems to me that things are going
very well for you right now in your campaign.
SANDERS: They are going very well. We had a wonderful kick off in
Burlington, Vermont, with over 5,000 people, tremendous turnout in New
Hampshire, great overflow crowds in Iowa. Then we were in Minneapolis on
Sunday morning, and we put this meeting together only with a few days
advanced notice. We have 4,000 people coming out.
So, I think the message is resonating. People are tired of
establishment politics and economics. They want to be part of the movement
which stands up to the billionaire class and says, enough is enough. Our
country, our government belong to all of us, in just a few.
So, I think things are going well so far.
MADDOW: You had, as you mentioned, that very large turnouts in
Minneapolis on very short notice, thousands of people turning out to see
you. More people that can fit -- than could fit in the venue.
"The New York Times" also described your event last Thursday in
Davenport, Iowa, as the largest turnout any candidate from either party has
been able to turn out in Iowa so far this year.
When you first declared, one of the things that we talked about was
whether or not you felt like you were able to upscale the infrastructure of
your campaign to take advantage of all that enthusiasm. Is that -- is that
under way?
SANDERS: It is, Rachel. It`s tough stuff. We are going to be very
clearly be outspent by our opponents. I don`t have the super PAC.
Millionaires are not going to contribute to my campaign.
But as of now, we have had contributions at BernieSanders.com from
130,000 Americans with an average contribution of about $40. We have had a
lot more people sign up and want to help out in the campaign.
So, what we`re trying to do now is build the infrastructure, put more
people on the ground in Iowa and in New Hampshire and elsewhere and we`re
scaling up literally as we speak.
MADDOW: You`ve also made a dramatic and creative proposal, I think in
terms of how the debate schedule ought to be changed. And you`ve made a
bunch of suggestions to the Democratic Party in terms of the things you`d
like, ways you think could be done differently and more creatively.
But why specifically are you proposing that Democrats and Republicans
should start debating each other now before the two parties have their
nominees?
SANDERS: I will tell you why, Rachel. In a sense, the Republicans
get away with murder. They have an absolutely reactionary agenda. You
know, they may vary a little bit from this candidate to the other. But
basically, what these guys are about are huge tax breaks for billionaires,
massive cuts in Medicare, Medicaid, education, nutrition, environmental
programs. And also clearly, some of the Republican candidates like Jeb
Bush and Chris Christie have talked about, they want to cut Social
Security.
Now, they get away with that stuff because a lot of people don`t know
what they are talking about. And I think we -- if we can confront them,
honestly, and say to their face when so many seniors are struggling right
now, how in God`s name are you talking about cutting Social Security when
we should expand it? When kids can`t afford to go to college now, why are
you talking about cutting Pell grants by $90 billion? Why are you on the
payroll of the Koch brothers and other billionaires rather than addressing
the needs of other working families?
If we can confront them and debate issues rather than allow the media
to get into political gossip and polling and fund-raising, but talk about
the issues, I think their agenda does not reflect more than 15 percent or
20 percent of the American people.
MADDOW: When I think about the Republican candidates and their
motivations, what they might want to be do, it`s hard for me to imagine
strategically that a lot of them would want to start debating with the
Democratic side for I think some of the reasons that you just described.
But in a smaller sense, a lot of them are really up against it in terms of
not making it into their party`s formal debates. Because of that, because
there may be some desperation among credible Republican candidates, are you
thinking about going outside the system and trying to ad hoc organize these
things with the Republican candidates?
SANDERS: I think -- look, Rachel, in the last elections, 63 percent
of the American people didn`t vote, 80 percent of young people didn`t vote.
It is no great secret that political consciousness in this country is not
terribly high, which is not an accident. That`s what the big money people
really want.
So, I think in any way we can -- that we can create serious debates on
serious issues. How can the Republican Party ignore science in terms of
climate change? With so much massive income and wealth inequality, why do
they want to raise taxes on working families?
So, I think the more we have that clash of ideas, I think we win. I
think people become more engaged in the political process. I think it`s a
good thing for progressives. I think it`s a good thing for American
democracy.
MADDOW: Senator Bernie Sanders, candidate for the Democratic
nomination for president of the United States -- sir, it`s always great to
see you. Thank you very much for being with us.
SANDERS: Thank you, Rachel.
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