Providing for Consideration of H.R. No Hires for the Delinquent IRS Act, and Providing for Consideration of H.R. IRS Oversight While Eliminating Spending (OWES) Act of 2016

Floor Speech

BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT

Mr. SESSIONS. Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the gentleman from Ohio (Mr. Stivers), who is a member of the Rules Committee, for not only yielding me the time, but also for the service that he gives to the Rules Committee, the hours of deliberate work, reading, and thought process.

I also want to address, if I can, as the gentleman from Ohio (Mr. Stivers) did, with great admiration not only to Judge Hastings for always constantly staying with issues and ideas that not only affect his district in Florida, but that really address the entire country.

I was delighted yesterday when the gentleman brought up in a most thoughtful, genuine way: Where is the answer to these important questions?

What we are here today, Mr. Speaker, to do is--as the gentleman from Ohio (Mr. Stivers) talked about, we are here to have, I think, once again a thoughtful debate about some problems that we think we see.

The role of the United States Congress, on behalf of the American people, is to make sure that we provide proper oversight, that we fund well and faithfully the running of the government.

As we see things that happen from time to time, it is our role to make sure that we are providing the debate, the argument, the facts of the case, and that is what we are doing today about the IRS.

The gentleman from Ohio (Mr. Stivers) did talk about H.R. 4885, IRS Oversight While Eliminating Spending Act. There is more to the story about fees that are being collected by the IRS.

I am going to read here directly about what they have done. Mr. Speaker, traditionally, the IRS has used this money that they collect in fees, that they collect for work that they do that goes directly back into customer service, sustaining themselves in the eyes of the public, taking calls, answering questions, trying to be of a service nature.

We understand the IRS is an organization that is there to collect taxes and very few people want to pay certainly more than what they have to. But in doing that, in complying with the law, it is not unusual that a taxpayer would want to contact the Service to learn more about paying their taxes, properly reporting their taxes, and properly doing things.

So, historically, the user fee account has primarily supported taxpayer services in the past. However, the Ways and Means Subcommittee on Oversight found that, in fiscal year 2015, the IRS deliberately diverted resources away from taxpayer services toward other agency functions, including implementation of the Affordable Care Act.

So they took their eye off the ball that they had previously done to change that. In fiscal year 2014, the IRS spent $183 million in these user fees on taxpayer services, which was 44 percent of the user account fees. That is what they used it for: 44 percent.

In fiscal year 2015, however, the agency spent only $49 million--from $183 million to $49 million on taxpayer services and only 10 percent of user fees from those accounts that came in. That decision amounted to a 73 percent reduction in user fee allocation.

Now, Mr. Speaker, what we are trying to say today to the IRS--because this is how we give them oversight. We hold a hearing. We do a markup. We bring the ideas to the Rules Committee.

The Rules Committee notifies all the Members that, if you have an idea about how you would like to talk about this bill, there is an amendment process. For both the rules that we are doing today, we made all of the amendments in order that were germane.

What we are saying here, Mr. Speaker, is that we disagree with the IRS. We are going to force the IRS to begin using these user fees in the way that they have historically done so that the public, which are taxpayers, have a chance to comply with the law, to get their questions answered, and to do business as is necessary.

The IRS has intentionally changed the way they do business to the detriment of the customer. Republicans all the time argue we ought to be more like customer services or a business-type organization.

BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT

Mr. SESSIONS. Mr. Speaker, so what we are trying to say today, which we would like to do on a bipartisan basis, which we would like to do straight up and look right at the IRS, is say: We would like to meet you in a way to where you know what we think. We would like to be very specific. We would like to show you exactly what we are talking about. We would love to have you comply.

In this case, it is taking a piece of legislation that we think is in the best interest of the IRS--because we are helping them protect themselves--and Congress that has oversight and an administration that we would welcome this opportunity. This is not some sneaky attempt to do something wrong. This is the right attempt.

The second part of the rule is H.R. 1206, No Hires for the Delinquent IRS Act. That simply says that we want to make sure that the Commissioner of the IRS understands that they should not hire any new employee if they have a tax problem.

I would think that would be part of the agreement. I would think that an employee of the IRS would understand that, to be faithful to their job, they should not be given an extra status better than any taxpayer who pays their taxes, has done what they are supposed to do, and follows the law.

Mr. Speaker, that is why Republicans are on the floor of the House of Representatives today. I am proud of what Congressman Stivers is doing. I support this rule that is a fair and logical rule for the best interest of us working with the IRS, with our colleagues that are Democrats and Republicans, and with the administration.

BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT

Mr. SESSIONS. Will the gentleman yield?

BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT

Mr. SESSIONS. Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the gentleman engaging me in a colloquy.

In fact, on a bipartisan basis, that was achieved, and the President of the United States signed the legislation. That was because of the gross examples of the IRS' conduct as it was related to politicalization. That would be correct.

BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT

Mr. SESSIONS. Yes, sir. In fact, I do. But I also recognize--and the gentleman knows this. You are making a very, very good point. They did not use it for something they were not authorized to do.

My point is that I think what we are trying to say is we would like to get the IRS to answer more questions. Some of the people who might be asking questions, it might be related to the Affordable Care Act because, in fact, it is a new portion of the law. And the IRS, I believe, has a duty to at least balance what they do, sir.

BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT

Mr. SESSIONS. Mr. Speaker, the gentleman makes a very important point. I would respond back by saying it is probably my fault and Members' fault. We do not ask that question.

I do not have a determination. I generally do not do a full background check. I do not have access to their records. I would not know if they were telling me the truth or not.

If you were a law enforcement organization or if you were a hospital looking for certification, if you were the IRS, you would have pretty much data available to you so that you didn't ask a question that you couldn't verify. So I think the gentleman makes a point.

I will tell you that this Member of Congress is now and has always been faithful and has not done anything with his taxes. I pay mine every year.

BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT

Mr. SESSIONS. Well, I agree with that. Once again, I don't ask the question, but the IRS should.

BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT

Source